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Post by reideen1313 on Nov 21, 2004 11:39:14 GMT -5
I liked this one. It was just a fun episode. Plain and simple. The midgets were great - I hope we see them (and more of Cluemaster) in future episodes.
Anyone think that the relation between Cluemaster and many "scalpers" was a coincidence? Think about it.
Big, fat obsessed guy sits in his mom's basement, eating his candy bars, dreaming about how he's going to get revenge on the people that did him wrong.
Then you have big fat, obsessed guy, sitting in his mom's basement, drinking mountain dew so he can be awake for the morning's first toy run, dreaming about how he's going to clean up on ebay and really show those people who did him wrong in high school.
Cluemaster = toy/comic scalper (or, in my case, the local comic shop owner....)? I think so! ;D
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Post by TJM on Nov 21, 2004 13:58:53 GMT -5
This episode wasn't horrible but it definately wasn't one of the best. I thought Cluemaster was a decent villain, no worse than Cluemaster in the comics, the writers gave him a pretty good backstory and a decent reason for doing what he was doing. I still don't understand what the midget henchmen had to do with anything, and why did Cluemaster have numbered pockets on his costume, I'm pretty sure he couldn't carry his henchmen around in them, heck the guy could barely carry his own body weight much less pockets full of midgets. I thought the end was pretty predictable, I mean who didn't know exactly what Bruce was going to ask Cluemaster, I would have preferred to see Bruce show off just how smart he is and actually stump Cluemaster with a real question. My biggest problem with this episode is the way Batman and Bruce were portrayed. I just don't see Bruce as the type of guy who would rather listen to crappy pop music instead of a piano concerto , I thought the vapid playboy routine was supposed to be an act not who he really is. I li And I don't think he would want to play checkers with Alfred, I don't think he believes he missed out on his childhood, because he spent his childhood doing exactly what he wanted to do, what he felt he had to do. Maybe he'd play chess, a game that requires some actual intellect.
And what's the deal with nobody being intimidated by Batman, not the kid, not the old lady, not Cluemaster, not even the kidnap victims, I thought at this point in his carrer Batman and his motives are more or less unknown, you would think people would be startled by the sight of him, but everyone seems to think a giant Bat is just business as usual. In fact not since Rupert Thorne in the first episode has anyone shown even the slightest hint of fear towards Batman. Another problem I had was the fact that the end of this episode took place during the day and here's Batman driving his Batmobile around in broad daylight, I don't think so, he would have found a more discreet way to get where he was going. Overall I think this was the weakest episode yet, but even BTAS had some clunkers during its run, I just hope this show rebounds on Saturday with a solid take on Scarface, and if Cluemaster must return I hope his next appearance is better than this one.
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Post by HUSH on Nov 21, 2004 14:44:10 GMT -5
Maybe he'd play chess, a game that requires some actual intellect. Exactly what I thought when I watched this episode!
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Post by Batdan on Nov 21, 2004 14:55:19 GMT -5
Here's my radical take:
This was an homage to the '60s show -- and I think it worked well, right down to the outlandish trap/faux game-show set and numbered, lookalike henchmen. The only thing missing was Mayor Grange (or the cast of Gilligan's island from "The Big Chill").
Some of you are getting wound up about whether or not Cluemaster will return. I highly doubt he's being set up as an integral part of the show. I think they are giving one of the campiest villains in the batcanon what he deserves -- a satire.
Star Trek had "A Piece of the Action." The Batman now has "Q and A."
Our favorite Dark Knight will survive.
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Post by TheBatBegins on Nov 21, 2004 21:58:23 GMT -5
I have been in love with Jeff Matsuda's The Batman from the onset but this entire episode made me want to throw up. I mean, I can take it for what it was and that it is a filler episode. The villain was lame in a Batman sense, but was goofy and at times fun to watch... ala the 60's show. My favorite parts was Alfred admitting to basically watching too much tv and when Batman said "I hope that can get buffed out." In reference to the ding the batmobile took. I also liked the loving interaction between Bruce and Alfred at the end, but I hope I never see this character again.
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Post by TheQuestion on Nov 21, 2004 22:12:03 GMT -5
yo! he was otho in beetlejuice!
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Post by Ralph Nigma on Nov 22, 2004 18:53:12 GMT -5
It was teh same plot as the first Baby Doll episode in BTAS, more or less.
It was acceptable. A decent episode for this show. It just kils me that Otho from Beetlegeuse played him.
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Post by Ra's al Rules! on Nov 23, 2004 7:20:16 GMT -5
this ep was ok but i still dont understand why they called him cluemaster? did he leave any clues/riddles/hints?? erm, nope. we all know the original cluemaster was a CRAP bad guy but at least he did leave some clues about his crimes, thus explaining the name. dont get me wrong, i was pleasantly suprised at how much i enjoyed this episode (yes i agree, those kung fu midgets would make GREAT figures!!) i just dont think the personality fitted the name (maybe if he was called "the gamesmaster" or something like that lol)
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Post by /\/\att on Nov 23, 2004 7:32:22 GMT -5
this ep was ok but i still dont understand why they called him cluemaster? did he leave any clues/riddles/hints?? erm, nope. we all know the original cluemaster was a CRAP bad guy but at least he did leave some clues about his crimes, thus explaining the name. dont get me wrong, i was pleasantly suprised at how much i enjoyed this episode (yes i agree, those kung fu midgets would make GREAT figures!!) i just dont think the personality fitted the name (maybe if he was called "the gamesmaster" or something like that lol) [shadow=green,left,300]clue: Something that serves to guide or direct in the solution of a problem or mystery Now, to me, someone arrogant enuf to think he holds the answers and solutions to most all questions could easily call himself Cluemaster with a decent level of legitimacy. Leaving little clues about his crimes only makes him the Riddler. lol.[/shadow]
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Post by Ra's al Rules! on Nov 23, 2004 8:25:51 GMT -5
[shadow=green,left,300]clue: Something that serves to guide or direct in the solution of a problem or mystery Now, to me, someone arrogant enuf to think he holds the answers and solutions to most all questions could easily call himself Cluemaster with a decent level of legitimacy. Leaving little clues about his crimes only makes him the Riddler. lol.[/shadow] i understand what you are saying /\/\att, i still feel that the name doesnt fit. oh, i forgot to mention, i was eating a bowl of oreo's cereal while i was watching this ep. "oreos" "kremelos" see the link? fingers crossed i dont end up that big ;D ;D (BTW, /\/\att, thank you for giving me membership ;D i hope to be here a long time!! )
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Nuptse
Legions Of Gothamite
Veni, Vidi, Velcro.
Posts: 64
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Post by Nuptse on Nov 23, 2004 12:26:25 GMT -5
I agree with others that cringe at the idea of Bruce as a 'normal' twenty-something guy that eats nachos and prefers checkers to chess. Batman seems more disconnected from him, taking that characterization that the writers seem to carry from episode to espisode. But consider that it *is* still a cartoon directed mostly at kids, and young boys at that, so they have to cater to their common audience. It gives the 6-12 year old boys out there something to identify with. This could be the first exposure kids that age have to the story, so building a Bruce they can identify with is probably more important to them than the brood factor. Not that I'd rather see it that way. I like a large side helping of darkness with my Bat. I cheered for the loomy bits in this ep, and the comment about The Work being more important to him than being a kid. Overall I thought it was a fun mid-level episode, a bit light considering some of the other material already screened, but it did go some way toward showing that Batman is also a *detective.*
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Drizzt2218
Legions of Gotham Police Officer
Posts: 165
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Post by Drizzt2218 on Nov 23, 2004 15:34:08 GMT -5
My biggest problem with the show right now is how uneven it is. This episode, again, demonstrated both a strength to the writing and an equal amount of material that was decidedly un-Batman and didn't fit with a "Batman" show.
Other people have already listed the problems with Bruce listening to pop music during the concert--that's not who Bruce is. Even were he putting on his act (which frankly, he wasn't) Bruce would listen to the concert and appreciate the music. Not only that, but it seems to blatantly send out the message of "Look kids! Even Bruce doesn't like this stinky music!" Which, you know, is *wrong* and discourages children from opening their minds to classical music or composed music or opera, or even art in general. I don't think it's looking too closely at something to say if a cartoon discourages this, it is a bad thing. And it's not even in character, which frustrates me more.
I also resent the idea that this Bruce feels he missed out on his childhood--because he's doing exactly what he wanted to do from the moment his parents were killed. They could have tied it a little more broadly to his mourning for his lost parents. As it stands, the dialogue was clunky and didn't feel like something Batman would even be thinking about. And checkers? No. Just no. Chess, yes. Again, this is needlessly simplifying and making Bruce immature for the kids, when a game like chess might encourage them to broaden their minds.
Cluemaster was an interesting villain for a single episode, but I don't believe he could sustain another appearance unless he was pitted *against* the Riddler somewhere down the road. As it stands, this was a fun episode, and were it B:TAS I probably wouldn't be complaining--but this series really needs to hit a couple more episodes out of the park, and this was not one of those. I also wonder if they are purposely trying to be campy at this point--it seems at least a couple of episodes have veered off into homage to the 60's show, and I hope that will not be a trend.
In all, despite my complaints, this was not a bad episode; in fact, I'd call this a "somewhat good" episode, and better than "The Big Chill" by far, not nearly as good as "The Man Who Would Be Bat," "The Big Heat," or "Call of the Cobblepot," about on par with "Traction" (another episode with some real uneven scripting--I mean c'mon, we have this great flashback in an episode that also includes Bruce spilling *nachos* all over Alfred?) and the Catwoman episode (the name of which escapes me).
I really wish the show would drop the minor details that try to make this series more hip, because they don't fit and are awkwardly crammed into Batman's world, and even these little scenes are diminishing the stories. Oswald's lines about "being in da house!" for instance, the nachos scene, Bruce jamming to pop music instead of classical music--these things are pointless and should be dropped.
A bonus for this episode was that the dialogue was a lot crisper--far less groan-inducing puns again, for instance. And the "Who is The Batman" question at the end--even if you saw it a mile away, was pretty darned cool. I also liked the action scenes and overall pacing of this episode--I think most of the episodes should be paced like this one and "The Big Heat."
I'm going to give this episode a B, and I cannot wait for the Scarface episode--I just hope that this "giant Scarface" aspect isn't going to ruin the character.
This episode was better than anything else on a Saturday morning, but it could have been even better with only a few minor tweaks to the material.
--Larry
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Post by HUSH on Nov 23, 2004 17:40:03 GMT -5
Great post as always, Drizzt2218. Although, IMO, The Big Chill was better than The Big Heat, and Traction has been the second best ep so far; The Man Who Would be Bat is my favorite.
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Drizzt2218
Legions of Gotham Police Officer
Posts: 165
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Post by Drizzt2218 on Nov 23, 2004 20:38:14 GMT -5
Hush, I'm sorry, I have to disagree. I don't see how you can rate any episode where Freeze utters the line "You're not sending me to the cooler!" as being higher than *anything*. And yes, he says this line: During the flashback, when Batman is pursuing him in the car chase. The Freeze episode had great voice acting, great action sequences--but the second you *listen* to the episode it becomes utter crap.
Let alone needlessly stripping down the Freeze character into a generic thug who gets some ice powers--yes, you cannot have the same origin for Freeze anymore, nor would they (or should they) try to copy what B:TAS did anyway. But they could have added in more details, at least a little more depth, let alone try to inject their own clever elements, into the character. As it stands, it honestly felt like Greg Weisman either doesn't understand Batman or wasn't even trying, and that's just a recipe for disaster. The Big Chill may have looked pretty, the action may have been awesome, and Clancy Brown may be a great voice actor, but the scripting itself was weak and a travesty.
But yes, "The Man Who Would Be Bat" was awesome, and if you look past some of the lesser elements of "Traction" (that didn't even need to be in the episode, no less, and I have found to really bother me as a viewer) and focus exclusively on the flashback, the Batbot action, and the drama, then I think "Traction" was a great episode. It just had moments that were so off as if to feel like they belonged in another cartoon, but the overall package was very good, indeed. The team should be remarkably proud of the flashback alone.
--Larry
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Post by reideen1313 on Nov 23, 2004 22:10:16 GMT -5
Other people have already listed the problems with Bruce listening to pop music during the concert--that's not who Bruce is. Who's to say that Bruce doesn't prefer a little rock n roll? Even were he putting on his act (which frankly, he wasn't) Bruce would listen to the concert and appreciate the music. I can see him listening to the concert, if he thought it might be useful later somehow. Other than that, the only reason he is there is to keep up appearances - the Wayne family is supposed to support the arts, so that's what he's shown doing. Even though it's not something that he particularly enjoys. Not only that, but it seems to blatantly send out the message of "Look kids! Even Bruce doesn't like this stinky music!" Which, you know, is *wrong* and discourages children from opening their minds to classical music or composed music or opera, or even art in general. I disagree. As a parent, it's ultimately my responsibility to educate my children. Not the school, not TV, and certainly not a Batman cartoon. I've taken my kids to Shakespeare on the Green, the local museum, jazz festivals, etc in an attempt to bring culture to their lives that I wasn't exposed to when I was growing up. I'm the most important role model in their lives - not Batman - so saying this is a bad message to give kids is crap. Maybe that arguement works with people that sit their kids in front of the TV all day, but not with me. I'm proud to say I take an active role in my children's day to day lives. It's my job. I'm Dad. I also resent the idea that this Bruce feels he missed out on his childhood Why wouldn't he feel that way? Do you honestly think that Bruce is above a common feeling of regret? I think that's one of the reasons he does what he does. (Well, that and he's obsessed, but that's a different thread.) because he's doing exactly what he wanted to do from the moment his parents were killed. No - he's doing what he feels he needs to do to make sure something like that never happens again - it all comes back to his obsession.... And checkers? No. Just no. Chess, yes. I agree here - checkers are out of character. Chess would be more appropriate for him. Again, this is needlessly simplifying and making Bruce immature for the kids, when a game like chess might encourage them to broaden their minds. Here is where we disagree though. I've a funny story - indulge me for a moment. I was at the mall with my kids a couple of weeks ago. One of my sons and I were waiting for my wife and daughter, and we found one of those glass chess sets that seem to be everywhere right now. He asked if we could play - I said sure and I started to move the pieces like checkers. He stopped me and said "Dad - that piece can't move that way. It only moves here or here." My jaw just about hit my shoes. I was shocked - I asked him where he learned to play chess. He said he learned at school. Now, keep in mind, he is 9 years old. I didn't learn to play chess until I was around 12 or 13. I think that based on the target age range of the audience for this show, checkers was appropriate. Some kids though, will suprise you and be more advanced. It happens. I don't think it was an attempt to "dumb down" the show, but more of an attempt to show him playing a game the kids could identify with. Just my $.02
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Post by HUSH on Nov 23, 2004 23:01:44 GMT -5
Why wouldn't he feel that way? Do you honestly think that Bruce is above a common feeling of regret? I think that's one of the reasons he does what he does. (Well, that and he's obsessed, but that's a different thread.) No - he's doing what he feels he needs to do to make sure something like that never happens again - it all comes back to his obsession.... I feel that aside from feeling it's his duty to fight crime, Batman truly enjoys it. Also, he does want to make sure it never happens again, but I believe that he has a feeling of vengefulness, and sees every villain as his parents killer. That's why he hits them so hard. ;D And I do indeed think that this is what he wants to spend his life doing, and all he's wanted since his parents were killed. He feels he needs to, but he also wouldn't want his affectionless life after the murder to be any other way, unless, of course, his parents were still alive. As I said, this is his self-imposed duty, but also a life he has a passion and love for. IMO.
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Drizzt2218
Legions of Gotham Police Officer
Posts: 165
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Post by Drizzt2218 on Nov 23, 2004 23:09:24 GMT -5
Let's see...I'm bad with the quote thingy, so please bear with me on this. Sorry.
Bruce has, as a character, been shown to appreciate the arts since as far back as the 1970's, back when serious characterization was put in place, post campy 60's series. Here is a character who studied abraod for years becoming familiar with everything he could, learning as much as he could, perfecting his mind and body. If *anything* (even if, let's say this Bruce likes his rock music and cannot stand to listen to classical music) Bruce would have the patience and respect not to put on earphones at this concert.
Okay, now let's see...yes, as a parent, it is your job (and I mean a parent's job in general here, not just you specifically) to encourage your children to broaden their minds and take in a wide variety of culture and life. However, I don't see how it can be disputed that the shows kids watch, and the characters kids think of as their heroes, idols, whatever, shape their reactions and responses. If they are naturally biased towards disliking classical music for example (and what kid usually isn't?) their resolve is only strengthened by seeing this form of art effectively ridiculed in a popular cartoon or television series.
Look at it this way, "Justice League," in one episode, features Batman singing...and not only that, but singing a *classic* song. That may be a kid's first exposure to that type of music, and it was delivered in such a way as to make it cool and interesting, to possibly even get them interested in that form of music. Batman probably could have belted out a Backstreet tune or whatever is hip these days, they could have poked fun at the song ("Am I Blue?") but they didn't.
I'm not so certain The Batman would take this approach. And the reason seems to be that if they give Bruce childlike attributes and make him more immature, kids would identify with him more...but they aren't being true to the Batman character when they add these touches in, and usually it is these little touches (which are insignifigant, as well) that seem awkwardly placed. If it fit in naturally with the Batman's world, that would be one thing, and nobody would have anything to complain about. But as it stands, these little touches as they are stand out like a red blotch on a white shirt. Would this episode have been any different if they had shown Bruce taking a little interest in the concert? Not in any way except that it would have been true to Bruce's character and we'd not be having this discussion. Did nachos spilling all over Alfred contribute anything to the plot?
Anyway, I think it's funny that this *is* a discussion, because these are all little nitpicks. If these are the worst things for us adult fans to argue about over this show, I'd say that the fine folks over at WBA are doing something mighty right, indeed. =)
--Larry
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Drizzt2218
Legions of Gotham Police Officer
Posts: 165
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Post by Drizzt2218 on Nov 24, 2004 0:56:00 GMT -5
I was going to edit my post to add these thoughts, but this post became so long that I felt it needed to be its own posting. If anybody minds, I have no problem seeing it edited into my orevious post.
I may be nitpicking the show right now, but it's only because I honestly enjoy this series a great deal, and I only want it to succeed. I'm certain none of us want the show to fail, and judging by the ratings, the response in kids, the response in fans, the toy sales, etc. this series is a huge SMASH. But to me, as a fan and a viewer, that isn't enough. I want this show to reach the quality that we all know it is capable of, to reach the status of a great series.
It just feels to me like the writers are purposely simplifying certain things...to put it another way, when B:TAS came out, the creative folks felt that since kids were going to flock to Batman no matter what, they could also write more adult stories that older fans would appreciate...and if you look back at these episodes as you get older, you even learn to appreciate them more and see more complexities.
Right now, The Batman is still trying to find its own unique voice (similar to the struggle Teen Titans went through in the first season) that will appeal to the younger crowd as they try to update the Batman mythology for the 21st century while still telling stories that anyone and everyone can appreciate.
By the end of season one I hope it will have found this voice and we'll be watching that one episode that pulls everything together (similar, again, to what Teen Titans went through), and that we'll see a fantastic second season as they settle into what this series is going to be.
It's a difficult time to mount a show as ambitious as this one, and the cartoon landscape is spastic at best--B:TAS wasn't competing as much as The Batman is with other shows and other mediums and other interests. It's an uphill battle that I think "The Batman" is going to win, but that doesn't mean I won't be conscious of what I think are trouble spots that this show needs to overcome.
Should it be B:TAS? A resounding no. It should be "The Batman"--whatever the series finally becomes. At this point, it's a work in progress--that could also easily become the finest cartoon *since* Batman: The Animated Series.
--Larry
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Post by Peev34 on Nov 24, 2004 1:14:09 GMT -5
[shadow=blue,left,300]Anyone else find it funny that Larry's posts are longer than the actual episodes? ;D LOL. Kidding of course and once again, very nice, well thought out posts, Larry! Even though I do not agree with most of what you have to say in this instance, I appreciate the feedback! There were many things about this episode that I liked. I enjoyed the take on Cluemaster. One reason being mainly that ANYTHING is better than the comic version! There is always something fun to me about "the good child gone bad" aspect that they took with him. Very well done. Also, this version of Alfred is one I am growing to appreciate more and more each week! I love how he is interpreted as one who, while fully supporting Bruce's choices in life, does not completly approve of them. "Play is the work of children" was a great line to illustrate that point.[/shadow]
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Post by reideen1313 on Nov 24, 2004 1:20:44 GMT -5
Bruce has, as a character, been shown to appreciate the arts since as far back as the 1970's, back when serious characterization was put in place, post campy 60's series. Here is a character who studied abraod for years becoming familiar with everything he could, learning as much as he could, perfecting his mind and body. If *anything* (even if, let's say this Bruce likes his rock music and cannot stand to listen to classical music) Bruce would have the patience and respect not to put on earphones at this concert. I would agree that Bruce would enjoy the concert. However, if he has some downtime, that required him to play the Bruce Wayne social butterfly role, why not do something that he enjoys? No one saw the earphone and it appeared that he was watching the concert. No harm no foul. Okay, now let's see...yes, as a parent, it is your job (and I mean a parent's job in general here, not just you specifically) I understand to encourage your children to broaden their minds and take in a wide variety of culture and life. However, I don't see how it can be disputed that the shows kids watch, and the characters kids think of as their heroes, idols, whatever, shape their reactions and responses. That appears to be my key issue with your statment. The fact that a Saturday morning cartoon show can influence my child enough to discourage them from listening to a different type of music would tell me that I'm not doing my job as a parent. Yes, the show will influence them - I have to counterbalance that influence. There's not a kid that I've found that can resist Rimsky-Korsakov's "Flight of the Bumblebee" or even Wagner's "Flight of the Valkyries" - especially when you tell them the story behind the music. Flight of the Bumblebee alone has been done in just about every musical style possible which, in exploring the different styles that are out there, can lead to a new appreciation for music and eventually other art forms. So to say this show is doing a disservice to children by showing Bruce listening to a headset while at the concert is, IMO, just plain wrong. Look at it this way, "Justice League," in one episode, features Batman singing...and not only that, but singing a *classic* song. That may be a kid's first exposure to that type of music, and it was delivered in such a way as to make it cool and interesting, to possibly even get them interested in that form of music. Batman probably could have belted out a Backstreet tune or whatever is hip these days, they could have poked fun at the song ("Am I Blue?") but they didn't. Also in JLU, Bruce is shown to be remorseful about not having a childhood when he said "I was never a kid." It's evident to me that it is something that he regrets, because if not for the loss of his parents, he would have had a happy, better than normal, childhood. Would this episode have been any different if they had shown Bruce taking a little interest in the concert? Not in any way I agree. except that it would have been true to Bruce's character I disagree - The Batman (I feel like a broken record here) appears to be taking the character and stripping it to the core. Then the character is updated and the best attributes are amplified to make the character more dangerous, evil, whatever. Did nachos spilling all over Alfred contribute anything to the plot? No, but it was a moment that I really enjoyed. It's little things like that that me and my kids laugh at every weekend. Anyway, I think it's funny that this *is* a discussion, because these are all little nitpicks. If these are the worst things for us adult fans to argue about over this show, I'd say that the fine folks over at WBA are doing something mighty right, indeed. =) I totally agree. I'm glad we can have a discussion like this without things getting out of hand - name calling, etc, like I've seen at other sites. I think we are both on a similar train of thought for the show, we just differ on some small points.
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Drizzt2218
Legions of Gotham Police Officer
Posts: 165
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Post by Drizzt2218 on Nov 24, 2004 1:34:36 GMT -5
Yeah yeah Peev, pick on the writer for writing long posts! It's okay, I'm not bitter...much. =D Reideen, you do make some great points that I'll admit have got me rethinking a couple of my own points (always the sign of a great discussion), and I have to agree that even if we don't see eye-to-eye on certain things, we both (and the kids--4 year old David and 3 year old Gabriel watch this show every Saturday and then during the week make me replay said episodes on tape) are enjoying this series and are fans of what they are doing. We may disagree on a few points, but that's what is great about any group discussion or group creative endeavor...the idea of having these discussions and differeing viewpoints on aspects of the material. Wouldn't it be boring if everyone agreed all the time? As it stands, you've certainly challenged my thoughts on the concert issue and Bruce's childhood, though I have to respectfully disagree on the nachos. And for the record, Steven Melching (who wrote this episode) is a great writer, and I hope we continue to see many The Batman episodes from him in the future--he brings something fresh to this series that would be sorely missed were he no longer involved, and thankfully, I think we'll continue to see his name associated with this series for quite some time. --Larry
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Post by HUSH on Nov 24, 2004 1:48:50 GMT -5
I would agree that Bruce would enjoy the concert. However, if he has some downtime, that required him to play the Bruce Wayne social butterfly role, why not do something that he enjoys? No one saw the earphone and it appeared that he was watching the concert. No harm no foul. Sorry to keep butting in here. ;D I, for one, just don't see why Bruce wouldn't want to listen to the concert. For the longest time in the comics, Bruce has been very appreciative of the classics, and he would rather listen to a concert than headphones. The point of this show is to show a Batman for the kids, but I don't think it should be at the expense of the character; and I know you'll disagree with me here, but even a small thing like headphones at a concert will, if it is out of character, detract from the character. And ignoring art is out of character for Bruce, IMO. Besides, I think that not paying attention to someone's great performance, even if they don't see, is rude, and, although TV shouldn't have that great an influence on children, when they have loving parents to raise them, the episode is still saying that it is okay, no, cool, because Bruce did it, to tune out an artistic performance that talented actors are putting on, and I, for one, don't think Bruce would do that, especially since he likes classical works of art. The only reason he would tune out the performance with headphones would be to put on the playboy act, but if no one saw, I'm sure Bruce would rather hear the concert. Bruce can be his art-appreciative self in The Batman, and maybe that will influence some kid somewhere to try listening to classical music, like it, and learn a lot. And no, I'm not saying rock'n'roll is bad, I do, in fact, love it, but what I am saying is that Bruce doesn't like it more than a classical concert. The Batman does, in my view, have to preserve BBruce's character, something which rock'n'roll, nachos, and "hip" phrases do not do, IMO. Sorry if this seemed like ranting about one little thing, but I do feel that little things build up, and I had to get that off my chest. ;D
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Drizzt2218
Legions of Gotham Police Officer
Posts: 165
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Post by Drizzt2218 on Nov 24, 2004 2:05:06 GMT -5
Hush, exactly my own feelings on the issue--especially when you said that "little things build up." The reason to nitpick is exactly that--if nobody ever nitpicked and just took the stance of "It was only one little thing," well, those little things will keep happening and growing in size until it becomes a big issue. I think there's a point where one can nitpick too much, but I also don't think this is that point.
However, I must also add that while I lean more heavily on the side of Hush, I do understand the argument being made by Reideen (and upon review, happen to agree with the thought that Bruce does on occasion mourn for his lost childhood...though I think it has more to do with mourning for a childhood spent as an orphan if I am articulating this correctly...that is to say, he mourns his lost childhood because he mourns his lost parents).
--Larry
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