|
Post by batman1973 on Sept 23, 2008 16:25:24 GMT -5
So, why let Morrison write for the regular continutity? I mean, instead of pissing off scores of fans and forcing the compaines to do reboots (I myself am getting tired of the reboots) just have the noodle do "Elsworlds" (DC) or "Just Imagine"(Marvel) series.
|
|
|
Post by jlavaia on Sept 23, 2008 18:22:55 GMT -5
^ that i dont know. i do know that his X-Men run was going fine until he decided that he wanted to kill off Magneto. Chris Claremont asked him not to as Claremont had plans for the character. Morrison decided that Claremont wasnt somebody he wanted to listen to and did it anyway. Marvel then forced Morrison to leave the company. Claremont is a god when it comes to X-Men. they had it that the Magneto that was killed wasnt really Magneto but a completely seperate character. Morrison came to DC and now he's doing iffy things with alot of characters. Batman fans arent the only ones that are upset. New Gods fans are irate after Morrison killed them all and brought them back as African Americans, basically destroying Jack Kirby's work and completely disrespectng Kirby. the difference between Morrison's time with Marvel and DC, is that with DC he has Dan Didio's complete support. he's being allowed to do this to the characters with complete permission and approval from his boss. unless the comics he writes plummet in sales to the point where it starts to lose Warner Brothers money, Morrison will retain his job. Dan Didio likes him and supports him, so he wont fire him or make him work on strictly elseworlds books.
|
|
|
Post by IamI on Sept 24, 2008 20:22:25 GMT -5
jlavaia, you hit the nail on the head. Didio is the reason we have not just Morrison's odd run but all the upheaval at DC these days. remember Didio is the one who almost killed off Nightwing a little while ago.
|
|
|
Post by havedunter74 on Sept 25, 2008 6:08:54 GMT -5
Its all gonna end in tears!!!
Morrison is showing complete contempt for all those great story writers and artists who created and made Batman who he is.
Bob Kane must be turning in his grave at what is happening to his greatest creation.
|
|
|
Post by batman1973 on Sept 28, 2008 15:35:10 GMT -5
Sounds to me that Dido and Morrison have gotta go. (Fat Chance, I know, but hey I can dream!)
|
|
SuperPa
Legions of Gotham Police Officer
Posts: 198
|
Post by SuperPa on Sept 29, 2008 7:05:55 GMT -5
Dido has to rign in Morrison a little bit the guys acting like he owns the characters that he writes and does what ever he wants.
|
|
batsy68
Legions Of Gothamite
"why do we fall bruce?" "errr.. so we can claim compo?"
Posts: 36
|
Post by batsy68 on Sept 29, 2008 11:48:44 GMT -5
Fan's should start an on-line petition and get Morrison out of there. My one few real joy's in life, and he's beating it with a s@£%*y stick.
|
|
Doomsday
Legions of Gotham Police Officer
Y'wanna know how I got these scars?
Posts: 234
|
Post by Doomsday on Sept 29, 2008 19:49:44 GMT -5
^ that i dont know. i do know that his X-Men run was going fine until he decided that he wanted to kill off Magneto. Chris Claremont asked him not to as Claremont had plans for the character. Morrison decided that Claremont wasnt somebody he wanted to listen to and did it anyway. Marvel then forced Morrison to leave the company. Claremont is a god when it comes to X-Men. they had it that the Magneto that was killed wasnt really Magneto but a completely seperate character. Morrison came to DC and now he's doing iffy things with alot of characters. Batman fans arent the only ones that are upset. New Gods fans are irate after Morrison killed them all and brought them back as African Americans, basically destroying Jack Kirby's work and completely disrespectng Kirby. the difference between Morrison's time with Marvel and DC, is that with DC he has Dan Didio's complete support. he's being allowed to do this to the characters with complete permission and approval from his boss. unless the comics he writes plummet in sales to the point where it starts to lose Warner Brothers money, Morrison will retain his job. Dan Didio likes him and supports him, so he wont fire him or make him work on strictly elseworlds books. That just proves that he's a nutjob when it comes to writing comics. Killing off Magneto? Please! I cannot believe DC even hired him. I havent been following it as much, but aside from Morrison, I'm actually pretty fond of R.I.P. Sure it has its...erm...bad parts...but I find it to catch my attention. Though this is definitely not one of their better storylines.
|
|
|
Post by havedunter74 on Sept 30, 2008 3:14:06 GMT -5
It seems that DC have shot themselves in the foot. When Knightfall was released back in the mid-nineties it was truly a piece of comic book genius and a story i still read on a regular basis as Bane is an immense villain,very intelligent and ruthless. I know Dc are trying to do the same sort of thing with RIP but it aint working. Morrison is soiling the Batman name.
Sort it out Morrison or get lost.
Im not a Marvel fan but to kill Magento is completely stupid!!!!
|
|
|
Post by SteveJRogers on Oct 2, 2008 18:42:27 GMT -5
The sad thing is though, you just know, as with Morrison's X-Men run, that when he is finally taken off, the first page of that new writer's first issue is Bruce Wayne waking up and saying "GOOD LORD THAT WAS ONE HELL OF A NIGHTMARE!" Not that I'd want the "change" to be permanent, but it is crazy to think of how utterly, and quickly things will be retconned as soon as Morrison or Dildo leaves.
|
|
mr. battastic
Legions of Gotham Police Officer
Eat floor.... high fiber
Posts: 124
|
Post by mr. battastic on Oct 6, 2008 17:47:30 GMT -5
can someone tell me who hush is? ive missed a few years of comics and when i jumped back in boom there he is. he beat the crap outta joker and causing all kinds of bs for bats. where did he come from?!?
|
|
|
Post by jlavaia on Oct 6, 2008 18:53:38 GMT -5
can someone tell me who hush is? ive missed a few years of comics and when i jumped back in boom there he is. he beat the crap outta joker and causing all kinds of bs for bats. where did he come from?!? Hush is Tommy Elliott, a childhood friend of Bruce's. he knows Bruce is Batman. he first appeared in the Batman arc, Hush.
|
|
mr. battastic
Legions of Gotham Police Officer
Eat floor.... high fiber
Posts: 124
|
Post by mr. battastic on Oct 8, 2008 16:45:16 GMT -5
thx ive trying find that out for awhile. way it was looking i thought hed be more involed with r.i.p. but it looks like jokers jumping in. im really wondering how morrison is gonna turn this or if hes crazy enough to take out bruce and replace him with tim
|
|
SuperPa
Legions of Gotham Police Officer
Posts: 198
|
Post by SuperPa on Oct 13, 2008 5:56:29 GMT -5
It wont happen, Hush wont become the new Batman.
|
|
Dorian Mimes
Legions Of Gothamite
We Came, We Saw, We Kicked Their Asses!
Posts: 79
|
Post by Dorian Mimes on Oct 13, 2008 9:49:00 GMT -5
RIP - What the heck can i say about that? All I can say is that I'm glad I'm not the only one who thinks RIP isn't all of THAT and a bag of chips! I have a few people tell me that I "just dont get it" and I simple tell them - there isn't anything TO GET! I mean - I'm still reading it, Im hoping the endding wont completely let me down - because thats all we comic-book readers can do - is hope!
Okay now - I want to just say - Grant Morrison - what the heck are you doing man?!
What happened to Arkham Asylum: A Serious House on Serious Earth Morrison? I mean I loved that comic, teh script was really great and - the story wasn't even really heavy handed! And now we get him with his RIP business and his killing off Magneato! He's simply gone a little to whilly nilly with these things.
And I'm an EXTREMELY hard core Joker fanatic - and I have to say - I am NOT AT ALL pleased with what he is doin' to my puddin'! Not at all!
But like I said - I'm going to continue to read them - for better or for worse - and hope it just doesn't blow up in my face.
|
|
|
Post by /\/\att on Oct 13, 2008 10:28:13 GMT -5
Lets all get into the specifics of what exactly you don't like about RIP. Many are saying that they dislike it, but no one is really saying why. I think other readers might want to hear from us all about what we do or don't like exactly about the arc thus far.
Personally, I'm not at all confused by it. ....not sure how you could be, its pretty straight forward. Weird? Yeah. But straight forward.
|
|
Dorian Mimes
Legions Of Gothamite
We Came, We Saw, We Kicked Their Asses!
Posts: 79
|
Post by Dorian Mimes on Oct 13, 2008 15:36:10 GMT -5
You're right - let's get down to what's wrong with it - and perhaps from there we can either a) Let those who do like the RIP series understand why we don't particularly like the falvor and b) Probably enlighten ourselves on the whole matter
I'LL START FIRST IN THE SEWING CIRCLEE! Lmao!
1. Joker - Oh Em Gee. I love Grant Morrison as much as the next comic fan, but I think he needs to stay the hell away from the Joker. I just STRONGLY dislike Morrison's new iteration on the Joker. The whole - shot in face (you knwo that part in RIP I think the new one that came out part 5 - ya - I can't believe he kept buggin Batman about it! Like, he REALLY TRULY believes Batman did it! And this guy, the Joker, he gets Batman and his unwavering sense of Justice and not to kill SO HE MUST UNDERSTAND THAT BATMAN DIDN'T DO IT! Oorrrr - if he does still think it ssooo, then wouldn't he be happy about it? Finally getting to the Bat so much that he'd resort to killing him?)- the wardrobe (He's topless in the fifth installment and I'm happy =D, but I don't like that...doctor overcoat thing he's wearing, HE'S NOT A DOCTOR HE'S A PERFORMER - A CLOWN - A JOKER WHO WEARS SUITS AND POMPADOURS AND SPATS! I mean I don't MIND a change in wardrobe so long as it - FITS his specific tastes and it's usually the finest!)- even the SMILE (Oy Vey. They decided they really DID want that unchanging smile gig. Talk about trying to milk the cow for all it's worth)! And thats a lot to say! The Joker I'm reading is a far, far cry from the witty, charming, devilish and theatrical Joker I'm used to reading. So far, Morrison's Joker has had all the depth and nuance of a generic serial-killer novel bogeyman. And the Joker is everything SANS generic!
What people fail to understand is, Joker is NOT just a killer. He's a performance artist who uses murder as part of the show - he's a showman above all else. What Morrison is doing is reducing him to just a killer. It's BORING and it's against everything the Joker is supposed to embody. I know people will point out to me that "the Joker has no definitive personality - found in Serious House on Serious Earth which you stated you actually loved." I know, but - with that little part - I don't think he was trying to say no "definitive" personality but - he's very flexible with many things. But he does INFACT have a core personality - he's a narcissist and positions himself as a comedian and a performance artist. His personality is very defined and quite absolute, and writers have adhered to this. The only reason sometimes he's found to be more playful some days and more grim and deadly the next is because THAT IS PART OF HIS PERSONALITY!
2. Bruce Wayen not Being Batman anymore? Okay that idea can either go TWO WAYS. One - he really DOES kill off Brucie and a lot of fanboys and galz are gonan be pissed (including myself) because - there simply CANNOT be another. Even in the cartoon series they pointed that out! You know at the end of the Justice League Unlimited which kinda tied in to Batman Beyond - where we find Terry was a clone of Bruce and yadda yadda yadda? Do you SEE THAT?! They cloned Bruce, and yet, Terry endded up nothing like him! Because there can only be one caped crusader - one can try to be him - as Terry goes to show - but they can never BE HIM.
And the second way it can all go down - Bruce doesn't give up his mantle. And then - well - we're all EXPECTING that! I mean, you can't kill of Bruce Wayne! He's BATMAN! And if things go down this route, it'll end up being predicable and limp. So either way you cut it - people are going to get upset. (Not to mention a lot of people think this is all just a publicity stunt to get people to read more - which makes us comic-readers feel used just because the company wants to go for the sock-factor rather than the quality. I mean, big things happen from time to time that does change things - I don't mind the large scale in which this is going I just don't think it's being written well and perhaps the plot could've been tweaked a bit to not make Batman's supposed death so black and white).
I mean - these are just a few things that pop into my head - It may seem a little rantish and well - all over the place. But I am not pointing out that I hate RIP, I'm just saying - it's got many flaws I wish would be cleared up before the end.
|
|
mr. battastic
Legions of Gotham Police Officer
Eat floor.... high fiber
Posts: 124
|
Post by mr. battastic on Oct 13, 2008 16:34:26 GMT -5
idk. i hope he learned his lesson at marvel and hes just throwing suspence all kinds of ways at us. but yea i dont think hes rdy for an uproar thats sure to come if he goes though wit it
|
|
|
Post by /\/\att on Oct 16, 2008 12:50:19 GMT -5
I don't know..one thing about the story that seems obvious to me....Tommy (hush) has altered his face to become Bruce Wayne.
Does anyone else agree?
|
|
|
Post by jlavaia on Oct 16, 2008 13:40:54 GMT -5
thats correct Matt. he plans on torturing Bruce by killing his allies and then becoming Batman and ending the career of Batman and then he plans on stepping down from Wayne Enterprises after which he will kill Bruce (which he obviously doesnt as this takes place right before the main R.I.P. story). "Heart of Hush" has been good and i've enjoyed it. we'll see how it ends next month.
the main R.I.P. story isnt terrible, but it isnt great either. i really dont like the insinuations that Hurt is Thomas Wayne and all the stuff with Thomas getting Martha addicited to heroin and that he hired someone to shoot him and kill his wife to keep everything secret and all the screwing with the origin of Batman. that stuff isnt necessary and its just wrong.
and then the other thing that bugs me, Morrison has decided to take away a great mystery of the bat world. its always been unknown if Joker really knows that Bruce is Batman. its never been shown that he ever had a clue, but Joker is very smart and other villains have figured it out fairly easily, so it made you think that maybe Joker does know. we now find out that basically Joker has known as seeing Batman unmasked provokes no reaction whatsoever from him.
|
|
|
Post by /\/\att on Oct 16, 2008 14:13:33 GMT -5
thats correct Matt. he plans on torturing Bruce by killing his allies and then becoming Batman and ending the career of Batman and then he plans on stepping down from Wayne Enterprises after which he will kill Bruce (which he obviously doesnt as this takes place right before the main R.I.P. story). "Heart of Hush" has been good and i've enjoyed it. we'll see how it ends next month. the main R.I.P. story isnt terrible, but it isnt great either. i really dont like the insinuations that Hurt is Thomas Wayne and all the stuff with Thomas getting Martha addicited to heroin and that he hired someone to shoot him and kill his wife to keep everything secret and all the screwing with the origin of Batman. that stuff isnt necessary and its just wrong. and then the other thing that bugs me, Morrison has decided to take away a great mystery of the bat world. its always been unknown if Joker really knows that Bruce is Batman. its never been shown that he ever had a clue, but Joker is very smart and other villains have figured it out fairly easily, so it made you think that maybe Joker does know. we now find out that basically Joker has known as seeing Batman unmasked provokes no reaction whatsoever from him. I did find that to be odd...I thought perhaps I had missed something and the Joker had found out without me knowing. I wonder..is it possible that this Batman in RIP is actually Tommy gone nuts and not Bruce?
|
|
|
Post by jlavaia on Oct 16, 2008 16:13:18 GMT -5
^ it definitely could be. he said he was planning on taking Bruce's place and infiltrating the cave. the Club of Villains attacked Batman in the cave and drugged him. Tommy's reaction to the drugs could be him actually thinking he is Batman. the only thing that throws that theory off is the stuff with Jezabel Jet. it would mean that Tommy had to be Bruce for alittle while before R.I.P. i mean the Detective arc takes place before the Batman one and its not stated how long before, so its possible. and if Joker knew that Tommy took Batman's place that could explain his non-reaction to an unmasked Batman. i mean the complete non-reaction indicates that Joker knew for years and had it confirmed well before this event. either Morrison screwed up somewhere and didnt research things, he got some bad intel, there was some kind of miscommunication with his artist, or this will be explained somehow next issue. because its quite mind boggling.
what we know for sure is that in Final Crisis, before his capture Batman is Bruce and that he seemed normal. Morrison said that R.I.P. and the follow-up stories take place before Final Crisis and are a lead up to what he has planned for Batman.
|
|
|
Post by /\/\att on Oct 16, 2008 16:19:34 GMT -5
You know, I hate to give the whole 'have faith' angle, but I think we all need to let this play out before we can judge it. Perhaps he does have a plan. If not, we'll know later and we can "RIP" it apart then. Yeah..bad pun.
|
|
|
Post by jlavaia on Oct 16, 2008 16:29:24 GMT -5
we'll find out soon enough. we still have a few months until Final Crisis ends in January, but R.I.P. ends next month. i'm hoping we'll at least get a few things answered definitively next month and then see exactly what he does with Batman in January.
|
|
|
Post by Batlaw on Oct 16, 2008 17:38:41 GMT -5
I really just cant wait for it to end.
|
|
|
Post by All Star Batman on Oct 17, 2008 12:08:07 GMT -5
we'll find out soon enough. we still have a few months until Final Crisis ends in January, but R.I.P. ends next month. i'm hoping we'll at least get a few things answered definitively next month and then see exactly what he does with Batman in January. And we'll see how it plays out in Batman in Feb.
|
|
Dorian Mimes
Legions Of Gothamite
We Came, We Saw, We Kicked Their Asses!
Posts: 79
|
Post by Dorian Mimes on Oct 17, 2008 15:37:06 GMT -5
I really just cant wait for it to end. Me neither - the madness must sttoopp!! In any case - I do have faith, if only just a little, it gets me by! Oh and probably a really bad time to say this but - I have NOT been keeping up with FINAL CRISIS what-so-ever! lmaao!
|
|
|
Post by All Star Batman on Oct 18, 2008 16:26:47 GMT -5
This is interesting: BATMAN AND THE OUTSIDERS SPECIAL #1 Written by Peter J. Tomasi Art and cover by Adam Kubert & John Dell Variant cover by Adam Kubert Spinning out of “Batman R.I.P.” and DC UNIVERSE: LAST WILL AND TESTAMENT, this special features the birth of a new era for the Outsiders and is a perfect entry point for past and present readers alike. FINAL CRISIS has changed the universe forever and though Batman may be gone, his legacy must endure. Forces are set in motion that give rise to a new team ready to combat the secret evil that the Outsiders were truly formed for all those years ago. Is Geo-Force the best leader? Or will Black Lightning prove to be a challenger? Plus, the introduction of a never-before-seen character important to the Batman mythos! Writer Peter J. Tomasi (GREEN LANTERN CORPS, NIGHTWING) is joined by Adam Kubert (DCU: LAST WILL AND TESTAMENT) for this extra-length one-shot spectacular, which is the opening chapter of an epic storyline that will continue within the pages of February’s THE OUTSIDERS #15! Retailers please note: This issue will ship with two covers. For every 10 copies of the Standard Edition (with a cover by Adam Kubert & John Dell), retailers may order one copy of the Variant Edition (with a cover by Adam Kubert). Please see the Previews Order Form for more information. On sale January 21 • 40 pg, FC, $3.99 US So are they saying Bruce will die but during Final Crisis? DC is confusing me. One thing for sure is that the future we saw of Titans Tommorow with Tim being Batman after Bruce died during a Crisis may be coming true.
|
|
|
Post by jlavaia on Oct 18, 2008 21:21:19 GMT -5
^ no, i think they mean gone from the team. he's not with the Outsiders anymore, hence the name change for the title with issue 15 being called just The Outsiders. also if this spins out of R.I.P. and Last Will and Testament then it has to take place before or right at the beginning of Final Crisis. at that time Batman is alive and is Bruce.
|
|
|
Post by /\/\att on Nov 6, 2008 11:19:30 GMT -5
|
|