|
Post by Eric on Dec 2, 2008 11:53:38 GMT -5
Could you tell me, briefly, how JPV is back?
|
|
|
Post by jlavaia on Dec 2, 2008 12:37:51 GMT -5
Could you tell me, briefly, how JPV is back? it hasnt been explained yet. he just appeared briefly in Gotham Underground. he didnt speak and he wasnt a part of the story, he was just there. he was also a part of Rip Hunter's notes in 52, where the notes stated "Jean Paul Valley Lives" and everything else Hunter had in his notes has come true so far and then Valley appeared in Gotham Underground making that true. he was also mentioned as alive in an issue of Checkmate.
|
|
wetstereorebel
Legions of Gotham Police Officer
"Oh, sweet Jesus. It's the goddamn Batman."
Posts: 206
|
Post by wetstereorebel on Dec 2, 2008 18:42:50 GMT -5
Well, I'm not reading Final Crisis, so that would explain why I have no idea about the current status of Bruce. Please do fill us in, then. Do you have any theories on how Bruce will "die" as of yet? Does it look to be the work of Darkseid? I'm sure you have at least a theory at this point. Final Crisis is actually quite interesting and i am enjoying reading it. the delays have been horrible though and the continuity problems are common. Morrison definitely is not reading books he's not writing and isnt talking to any other writers. 4 issues have finished. at the end of the 4th issue we get the return of the real Darkseid as we find out that the torturing and experimenting of Dan Turpin was to turn him into Darkseid. apparently the New Gods have entered the human bodies of others. Darkseid and Libra are the main villains of the story, and Libra is most likely one of the New Gods as well as he's much more powerful than he ever was before (i've heard he's really Glorious Godfrey, but nothing has been shown yet). Barry Allen is back and is alive. he and Wally are 3 weeks in the future right now. Martian Manhunter was killed in the first issue. there's only a handful of heroes not affected by the anti-life equation that was sent through the internet and broadcast over the media. Bruce isnt a huge part of the story right now. The Outsiders are going to look for him. my theory is that Bruce is the body for one of the New Gods, possibly one of the good ones like Orion. he'll become them and save the world and end the crisis and then will be that hero for awhile until DC and us readers get tired of reading a Batman that isnt Bruce and finally bring him back. he wont be dead. if not a hero and if all this "evil wins" stuff is true, then i see that Bruce is one of evil New Gods and helps destro the world, which of coarse would be that "fate worse than death" stuff we've been hearing. i can easily see Morrison have Bruce be one of the New Gods. that leads to my next theory and who will be Batman in his absence. i'm thinking it'll be Jean-Paul Valley. he's back, so wh not have him be Batman. he's been Batman before. people wont boycott the Batman titles because they'll want to know how and why he's back. it wont be like the first time he was Batman and he snapped, he became a true and good hero in his own title. i think it could work. I seem to remember Morrison stating in an interview that Batman wasn't going to be one of the New Gods. Or did Didio say that? Heck, did anybody say that or is it a product of my own 'Zurr-En-Arrhh' personality?
|
|
|
Post by All Star Batman on Dec 2, 2008 21:39:32 GMT -5
Well, I'm not reading Final Crisis, so that would explain why I have no idea about the current status of Bruce. Please do fill us in, then. Do you have any theories on how Bruce will "die" as of yet? Does it look to be the work of Darkseid? I'm sure you have at least a theory at this point. Final Crisis is actually quite interesting and i am enjoying reading it. the delays have been horrible though and the continuity problems are common. Morrison definitely is not reading books he's not writing and isnt talking to any other writers. 4 issues have finished. at the end of the 4th issue we get the return of the real Darkseid as we find out that the torturing and experimenting of Dan Turpin was to turn him into Darkseid. apparently the New Gods have entered the human bodies of others. Darkseid and Libra are the main villains of the story, and Libra is most likely one of the New Gods as well as he's much more powerful than he ever was before (i've heard he's really Glorious Godfrey, but nothing has been shown yet). Barry Allen is back and is alive. he and Wally are 3 weeks in the future right now. Martian Manhunter was killed in the first issue. there's only a handful of heroes not affected by the anti-life equation that was sent through the internet and broadcast over the media. Bruce isnt a huge part of the story right now. The Outsiders are going to look for him. my theory is that Bruce is the body for one of the New Gods, possibly one of the good ones like Orion. he'll become them and save the world and end the crisis and then will be that hero for awhile until DC and us readers get tired of reading a Batman that isnt Bruce and finally bring him back. he wont be dead. if not a hero and if all this "evil wins" stuff is true, then i see that Bruce is one of evil New Gods and helps destro the world, which of coarse would be that "fate worse than death" stuff we've been hearing. i can easily see Morrison have Bruce be one of the New Gods. that leads to my next theory and who will be Batman in his absence. i'm thinking it'll be Jean-Paul Valley. he's back, so wh not have him be Batman. he's been Batman before. people wont boycott the Batman titles because they'll want to know how and why he's back. it wont be like the first time he was Batman and he snapped, he became a true and good hero in his own title. i think it could work. I would rather not have JVP back as Batman, because 1. It'll be too much like Knightfall. 2. When he was Batman, he was too lethal, and allowed 2 people to die. I don't want to see Jason Todd as Batman either because it'll just be copying Marvel with Captain America by having the believed-to-dead-sidekick becoming his mentor. Plus, we've seen him be just as lethal as AzBats. Tim and Dick are the frontrunners here. My money's on Tim, because, 1. Dick has made his own identity as Nightwing. 2. DC has shown many possible future stories showing Tim as Batman (i.e. Titans of Tomorrow, Superman/Batman).
|
|
|
Post by jlavaia on Dec 2, 2008 23:51:38 GMT -5
^ see the problem with Tim as Batman is that Tim has seen those futures and doesnt want to be like that and doesnt want to be Batman. plus he's not as adept fighting wise as Batman needs to be. yes, he's very skilled, but he is the weakest fighter of the bat family. i'd love to see Cassandra Cain take the mantle, as that was her eventual role before they screwed with the character after OYL and they are still screwing with her even now so that wont happen.
and yes JVP was bad as Batman because he took lives and he snapped, but he did get himself under control. and if he's not wearing the Azrael costume he's fine. remember when he changed his costume from the normal red/gold to that wierd red/white one he wasnt the same. its when he puts on the actual Azrael costume that he's unstoppable. and this is DC we are talking about, they do like to rehash old stories that they've done before, with just a slight twist.
and remember its only a temporary move. i cant see it going on longer than Prodigal did anyway. and remember Bruce picked JVP and picked Dick to be Batman in his absense. he picked Harvey Dent to fill in for him during the OYL, not as Batman though, but to protect Gotham. he might not have the choice this time, depending on what happens to him in Final Crisis. DiDio did say that Bruce wasnt going to die in Final Crisis, so it means he's just incapacitated for alittle bit. but we are talking about Batman. he has contingency plans for everything, so i'm sure there is a plan for who takes over he's not around for alittle while.
|
|
|
Post by IamI on Dec 3, 2008 20:28:21 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by jlavaia on Dec 3, 2008 20:54:24 GMT -5
^ i honestly cant see this lasting that long. issue 700 will come out a year and a half from now. someone else will not be Batman for that long of a time.
|
|
|
Post by /\/\att on Dec 5, 2008 8:30:25 GMT -5
Well, I guess with Batman #682 we all can see that RIP was probably
SPOILERS!
a hallucination of some sort
|
|
|
Post by havedunter74 on Dec 5, 2008 9:32:46 GMT -5
if that is the case then tahs just pathetic. i think Morrison should get his head out of his butt and write a decent storyline.
ive been on his website and theres no way that he is a self centred pompous fool.......................NOT!!!!!
I'd like to apologise on the behalf of Britain for him.
|
|
jokermatt
Legions of Gotham Police Officer
Posts: 145
|
Post by jokermatt on Dec 5, 2008 17:07:32 GMT -5
Hey jlavaia could you tell me which issue of Gotham Underground that Jean Paul Valley was in. I don't remeber him at all and I don't want to go back and look at all the issues. thanks
|
|
|
Post by All Star Batman on Dec 5, 2008 22:39:54 GMT -5
Well, I guess with Batman #682 we all can see that RIP was probably SPOILERS! a hallucination of some sort I just refuse to believe that after all the hype R.I.P. got with the "death" of Batman, that Morrison, Didio, and DC would just cop out and say it was all a hallucination. That would be almost as bad as OMD.
|
|
|
Post by jlavaia on Dec 6, 2008 2:39:07 GMT -5
Hey jlavaia could you tell me which issue of Gotham Underground that Jean Paul Valley was in. I don't remeber him at all and I don't want to go back and look at all the issues. thanks #8. small cameo.
|
|
jokermatt
Legions of Gotham Police Officer
Posts: 145
|
Post by jokermatt on Dec 6, 2008 10:58:43 GMT -5
Thanks Hey jlavaia could you tell me which issue of Gotham Underground that Jean Paul Valley was in. I don't remeber him at all and I don't want to go back and look at all the issues. thanks #8. small cameo.
|
|
1047pm
Legions of Gotham Police Officer
"Who sleeps anymore?"
Posts: 151
|
Post by 1047pm on Dec 7, 2008 20:59:03 GMT -5
Well, I guess with Batman #682 we all can see that RIP was probably SPOILERS! a hallucination of some sort I just refuse to believe that after all the hype R.I.P. got with the "death" of Batman, that Morrison, Didio, and DC would just cop out and say it was all a hallucination. That would be almost as bad as OMD. Funny...someone I know said to me ..."Let me guess...then he will come out of the shower like they did in Dallas and it was all a dream!!"
|
|
mr. battastic
Legions of Gotham Police Officer
Eat floor.... high fiber
Posts: 124
|
Post by mr. battastic on Dec 8, 2008 18:55:20 GMT -5
i can understand trying to boost sales but this is a little bit ridiculous. theres a reason Morrison got the boot at marvel. bout time to give that other cheek a good kick
|
|
|
Post by jlavaia on Dec 8, 2008 19:33:16 GMT -5
^ he got booted from Marvel because he killed Magneto after Chris Claremont asked him not to. when it comes to the X-Men, Claremont is God. Morrison mistakenly thought he was above that.
|
|
|
Post by All Star Batman on Dec 11, 2008 0:02:37 GMT -5
More info on the future of Batman:
|
|
|
Post by /\/\att on Dec 12, 2008 14:13:47 GMT -5
Azrael is coming back early next year! I can't give you the details yet, but soon!
I knew this was gonna happen! I really hope for another run of Az-Bats!
|
|
|
Post by jlavaia on Dec 12, 2008 20:44:58 GMT -5
^ oh how i love when my predictions come true. that is great news though. i loved the original Azrael series. hopefully he'll get a new series when all the other mess finishes up.
|
|
mr. battastic
Legions of Gotham Police Officer
Eat floor.... high fiber
Posts: 124
|
Post by mr. battastic on Dec 12, 2008 21:40:49 GMT -5
i dnt know.....could they pull another power struggle like in knight fall? it'd be cool too see how that'd play out.
|
|
|
Post by Batlaw on Dec 13, 2008 1:55:15 GMT -5
Im all for a full on JPV/Azrael comeback. Just not sold on any rehashing of him playing Batman.
|
|
|
Post by bigjonempire on Dec 19, 2008 17:43:16 GMT -5
I have never been a fan of Grant Morrison's work and the reasons for that are on excellent display in R.I.P. 1) His blatant disregard for continuity. I'm not one that believes you need to stick strictly to things but I have limits. In this story Morrison jams a bunch of events that the original crisis eliminated from this version of Batman's history into a convoluted storyline that wanders from point to point without making much sense along the way. Go ahead and bring back all the lame characters you like. But you need to make them actually interesting. The mere fact that they appeared in batman comics in the 40's does not make it worth reading. And why bring back all the lame characters in the same story? Bat-Mite as a figment of Bruce Wayne's dellusions? That could have been an interesting angle to follow if it weren't jammed into an already hard to follow storyline. 2) He writes wierd things just for wierdness sake. They should give him a wierd tales comic to write. When this wierd stuff (like the flashforward story) is injected into the middle of storylines it just irritates me rather than entertains. I don't need Morrison to stick to a tight formulaic story but I do need him to have a few rules. 3) When he isn't being wierd he is completely uninspired. How many times have we seen Batman buried alive only to escape? The entire conclusion to R.I.P. is rushed. Morrison dragged the story out for a year or more and then crammed a hundred new story points into the concluding issue. 4) He doesn't write for the monthly readers. All of his stories are written for the people who will buy the collected edition. In fact the story is complete gibberish until you collect it all. Then its just bad. 5) Change for changes sake. This may be a personal problem but why mess with the core of a character. Bruce Wayne's parents and Alfred's integrity should be off limits. Mes with Bruce's mind if you like (that's completely cool) but don't suddenly decide that Bruce's parents were sexually deviants and Alfred is his real father. Like making the Beast a Lion in X-men. So irritating especially when there are no story based reasons. I could go on but I'm already ranting...
|
|
|
Post by All Star Batman on Dec 30, 2008 1:45:27 GMT -5
Despite initial concern from last issue, it was shown in Batman 683 that R.I.P. did still happen. And the possible explanation as to why Batman will be gone (IMO) is that he'll be on New Genesis investigating Orion's murder.
|
|
|
Post by jlavaia on Dec 30, 2008 2:30:49 GMT -5
Despite initial concern from last issue, it was shown in Batman 683 that R.I.P. did still happen. And the possible explanation as to why Batman will be gone (IMO) is that he'll be on New Genesis investigating Orion's murder. thats not possible. New Genesis isnt around anymore. it was merged with Apokolips. also, its doubtful that Orion is dead, as all the bad New Gods took over human bodies, so it makes sense that the good ones did too. and Orion said as much when he died anyway. Batman is currently gone because he's one of the many, many heroes that have been captured by Darkseid's minions.
|
|
|
Post by All Star Batman on Dec 30, 2008 13:13:47 GMT -5
Despite initial concern from last issue, it was shown in Batman 683 that R.I.P. did still happen. And the possible explanation as to why Batman will be gone (IMO) is that he'll be on New Genesis investigating Orion's murder. thats not possible. New Genesis isnt around anymore. it was merged with Apokolips. also, its doubtful that Orion is dead, as all the bad New Gods took over human bodies, so it makes sense that the good ones did too. and Orion said as much when he died anyway. Batman is currently gone because he's one of the many, many heroes that have been captured by Darkseid's minions. Yes, but that's not the reason why he'll be missing during Battle for the Cowl. We'll find out in when Final Crisis ends next month. But he may be investigating Orion's murder.
|
|
|
Post by jlavaia on Dec 30, 2008 14:54:59 GMT -5
^ he was investigating Orion's murder. thats what led to his capture. that already occured back in Final Crisis # 2. Orion should return before Final Crisis ends or shortly after. Orion's astral form inhabits someone's body, it just hasnt been revealed who yet.
|
|
|
Post by All Star Batman on Dec 30, 2008 23:27:52 GMT -5
^ he was investigating Orion's murder. thats what led to his capture. that already occured back in Final Crisis # 2. Orion should return before Final Crisis ends or shortly after. Orion's astral form inhabits someone's body, it just hasnt been revealed who yet. Man, I really gotta do research before posting these kinds of things. New theory: maybe Orion will possess Bruce?
|
|
|
Post by jlavaia on Dec 31, 2008 0:00:12 GMT -5
^ he was investigating Orion's murder. thats what led to his capture. that already occured back in Final Crisis # 2. Orion should return before Final Crisis ends or shortly after. Orion's astral form inhabits someone's body, it just hasnt been revealed who yet. Man, I really gotta do research before posting these kinds of things. New theory: maybe Orion will possess Bruce? thats what i'm thinking. i actually theorized that in an earlier post in this thread. i'm really thinking that Bruce will become one of the New Gods, if not Orion, then another one.
|
|
|
Post by batman1973 on Dec 31, 2008 0:00:42 GMT -5
Azrael is coming back early next year! I can't give you the details yet, but soon! I knew this was gonna happen! I really hope for another run of Az-Bats! Ok, at the risk of being banned.. ARE YOU HIGH? Az-Bats? Azrael was no Batman. As a seperate vigilante, maybe, but not as the Bat. He did things and crossed lines that Bruce would never.
|
|
|
Post by jlavaia on Dec 31, 2008 0:03:04 GMT -5
^ supposedly its not Jean-Paul Valley. from the hints and previews its hinted that the new Azrael is the Third Batman from right before R.I.P., Valley is back, but he hasnt really been used and he's only been seen in cameos so far.
|
|