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Post by MuksC on Jan 15, 2006 15:08:13 GMT -5
yeah, there are many inconsistencies in Begins concerning the gas.
Crane gives Rachel a supposedly stronger dose, and keeps saying she hasn't got long to live. but he (Crane) gets shot with exactly the same dose when Batman storms Arkham, and he doesn't get any antidote, yet is very calm and is able to ride a horse. even though he got away, are we supposed to assume that he eventually died due to the stronger dose he also received? he clearly doesn't have any antidote, or else he would have taken it long ago.
we didn't get to see all the fear effects that were supposed to be in the film though, so maybe Rachel freaked out a lot more in Arkham in the elevator, and also in the Tumbler while Batman is taking here to the Manor.
they were trying to get a 12 rating for the film, so they had to leave out the stage 2 Scarecrow and the more frightening hallucinations.
it would have been good if they weren't restricted in this way, and were able to make the film as frightening as they wanted, but its understandable that DC wanted kids to see it, to persuade their parents to buy the merchandise.
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Post by Dark Nightwing on Jan 15, 2006 15:15:20 GMT -5
I believe that because Bruce had a lot bigger fears, he had much worse hallucinations. Either that, or the couldn't because of the "rating issue".
As far as "not long to live", he said that the mind only has so long to live. And when Crane is on the horse, he is quite insane.
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Post by All Star Batman on Jan 15, 2006 16:45:20 GMT -5
And Crane is still pretty insane after he gets the gas. He says "Dr. Crane isn't here right now. But if you'd like to make an appointment...", that's pretty insane. Maybe in future movies, he'll start talking in nursery rhymes. For those who've read Haunted Knight, or the other Loeb/Sale books, you'd know what I'm talking about.
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Post by MuksC on Jan 15, 2006 18:58:33 GMT -5
but he seems quite sane in Arkham strapped to the chair. and also when he escapes and rides the horse.
surely without an antidote he would have gone completely insane and/or died, so no return in the future?
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Post by DBrennan3333 on Jan 20, 2006 4:28:13 GMT -5
but he seems quite sane in Arkham strapped to the chair. and also when he escapes and rides the horse. surely without an antidote he would have gone completely insane and/or died, so no return in the future? I agree that this entire line of action was inconsistent to the point of being a distraction. I think that anybody viewing it would take Crane's description of the affects to mean that Rachel would effectively become an invalid (and therefore that he would become one when he breathed the gas). That he was able to speak and ride a horse, and that Rachel was able to ask a question about her health, really dilutted the scariness of Scarecrow and the fear gas.
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Post by jasontodd2 on Jan 20, 2006 11:08:42 GMT -5
but he seems quite sane in Arkham strapped to the chair. and also when he escapes and rides the horse. surely without an antidote he would have gone completely insane and/or died, so no return in the future? He seems very sane, almost too calm for his fear gas to be taken really seriously in the movie. And another point that DBrennan3333 brought up about Rachel when she is in the tumbler she actually has a sense of where she is and what is going on because she asks Batman, "what are you doing ?" When he goes into the parking garage and eventually flies off the roof. I doubt that would happen, where Batman was barely able to call upon Alfred and then later he is mumbling in the back of the car like a man insane, and then he is out for two straight days, while Rachel is up and about without hours.
And I totally agree with your points about how The Scarecrow would not be able to survive and would probably have died at some point because of the dose he took.
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Post by MuksC on Jan 21, 2006 14:35:20 GMT -5
cool.
i put the subtitles on to check what Batman was saying when Alfred rescues him, something like "blood, poison, take blood, been poisoned"
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Post by All Star Batman on Jun 15, 2006 22:12:26 GMT -5
It's been exactly one year since the greatest Batman movie ever made was released. Happy Anniversary Batman Begins! ![](http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/f/f9/Batman_begins_xlg.jpg)
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Post by MuksC on Jun 16, 2006 5:21:01 GMT -5
wow, it's been a year already!
i was thinking of this a couple of days ago, but couldn't remember if it was June or July.
it's already been on dvd for many months also, how time flies!
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Post by Jack-Ups on Jun 16, 2006 10:31:23 GMT -5
[glow=red,2,300] Yep sure is!! ;D I was pleased to see Bats done in style! And they shouild release like a 1.5 Begins dvd with more extra's on it as I was craving for more!
![](http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e382/Jack-Ups/_40627174_batmanbale2.jpg) [/glow]
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dasknight
Legions of Gotham Police Officer
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I miss my parents.
Posts: 107
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Post by dasknight on Jun 17, 2006 2:21:24 GMT -5
I think that another extras laden DVD will be released prior to the release of the BB sequel. Warner Bros loves your money ![:-[](http://www.legionsofgotham.org/Forum/THEBATMANJOKERANIMATIONNEW.gif)
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Post by Jack-Ups on Jun 17, 2006 4:40:23 GMT -5
I think that another extras laden DVD will be released prior to the release of the BB sequel. Warner Bros loves your money ![:-[](http://www.legionsofgotham.org/Forum/THEBATMANJOKERANIMATIONNEW.gif) [glow=red,2,300] Your right if they did do it would be around the sequel! Just like they did with x-men 1.5 near the realese of X2! ![:-X](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/lipssealed.png) [/glow]
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Post by MuksC on Jun 17, 2006 8:34:54 GMT -5
as far as extras, the aspect i want to see more about is the suit and weapons. they touched on them all in the extras already, but i would have liked to see more in-depth stuff on how they designed and actually made the items.
the suit is such a big aspect, they should have spent more time on the actual making and test-fitting and maintenance of it.
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Post by Jack-Ups on Jun 17, 2006 9:07:28 GMT -5
[glow=red,2,300] Also I would of enjoyed seeing more of all the development stuff which was done in England so that was the costume the tumbler most of the actor's (test footage and stuff like that)also the giant air hanger that they built the narrows in should of been shown way more!three disc's even 4 would be excellent! ![::)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/eyesroll.png) [/glow] ![???](http://www.legionsofgotham.org/Forum/ICONcoolbat.gif)
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Post by MuksC on Jul 10, 2006 4:14:02 GMT -5
yeah i would have liked to see the auditions or screentests for the actors (surely Katie Holmes wasn't the only person to try out for Rachel???). and yes more footage of the Cardington Hangars would have been cool.
i was reading about them on friday while researching someting for university, how in 2003 they were used for simulating house fires, where they built a house inside, then could do all the tests they needed to by burning it down etc.
as someone suggested, they might release a bonus pack around the time of the release of the next movie, with all the extra goodies we didn't get the first time.
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Post by MuksC on Dec 3, 2006 8:56:52 GMT -5
just a bit of a nitpicky question, in the movie when they are ordering components to make the cowl, what catalogue are they looking in for the top part of the cowl, and for the "ears"?
what would those things be used for in a normal everyday environment? where do you buy those things from? what real life use do they have? is the top part of the cowl just a type of helmet? can't think what the ears would be used for though.
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Post by Blackgate on Dec 3, 2006 12:27:26 GMT -5
I belive it was a custom order that they made, meaning they designed them themselves
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Post by MuksC on Dec 3, 2006 15:02:00 GMT -5
hmm, not sure about that.
i think the point Nolan was angling for was that these components are already on sale somewhere in the world, so they just have to order them, then fit them together themselves making a Batman cowl. but who are they ordering from and what would Joe Public do with the ears, for example?
they could have designed the separate components themselves and contracted a factory somewhere in Singapore to make them for them, but it definitely looks to me like they are buying these bits "off the shelf" so to speak, as if they are already on sale somewhere.
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Post by Batlaw on Dec 3, 2006 15:20:33 GMT -5
As I recall and as I perceived it, I thought the documents with the suit designs were actually Bruce's designs and such coupled with he and Alfred comparing them to supliers cattalogs offering usable / workable materials and or products. Not Nec. the parts of the suit itself. the "ears" were hi-tech listening devices that thier design (size and shape) *conveniently happened to fit within the actual ears of their cowl (didnt we see Bruce fitting the completed components into an ear when he got them?). As for the cowl, Bruce found the company that has and uses the desired materials to make whatever the customer desires out of that specific material. He then supplied them with his specifications / designs (cowl w/o ears). Bruce ordered a suitable quantity of them to further avoid suspicion and chain of evidence leading to him and his mission.
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Post by MuksC on Dec 5, 2006 5:52:56 GMT -5
right, so if those were actually their own drawings/plans, then it would make more sense. they designed the cowl, the ears, and the electronic listening device to fit in the ears, then asked that fabrication company to make the first 2, while Bruce and Alfred made the listening device themselves to fit in the ears, and assembled the whole thing when they received them.
that makes a lot of sense, because we see Alfred test a cowl from the first batch with a baseball bat and say "problem with the graphite, the next batch will be up to specification", meaning they asked the cowl to be of a certain strength etc.
but those cowls only covered half of the head (the top half down to the top of the ears), so they would have had to make the reminaing lower part (the bit that covers the rest of the face and the neck) themselves also.
thanks for clearing it up.
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