dasknight
Legions of Gotham Police Officer
I miss my parents.
Posts: 107
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Post by dasknight on May 15, 2006 20:12:40 GMT -5
I haven't seen a similar thread here, so away I go!
You will agree, I'm sure, that Danny Elfman's score for Batman is iconic. It is, not only to us Batfans, as well known as "The Imperial March (Vader's Theme)" from Star Wars or John William's "Superman Theme".
Batman: The Animated Series, never required a title card. The opening sequence, set to Elfman's score was enough to tell viewers in '92 that they were watching Batman.
I was somewhat disappointed it was left out of Batman Begins. Should the theme be back in the sequel?
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Post by Dark Nightwing on May 15, 2006 20:31:56 GMT -5
Should the theme be back in the sequel? I would say no. I love his theme for BTAS. It fits so well, but for the sequel I completely disagree. This will only bring about further comparison between the two and would confuse some people. Not to mention that I seriously doubt that they would do that partly to be different from the "other" Batman series and partly because then they would have to cut a check to Elfman. On a side note, I find Elfman to be too obvious with his movie scores. Music is for movies is an effect to inspire the correct emotion. Elfman just bangs you over the head with how you are supposed to feel that it hurts. That isn't to say all of his work is like this. I think he did do a great job for The Nightmare Before Christmas because it is a musical. Musical are kind of supposed to be obvious because there is little or no unsung dialogue.
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Post by crazyhatter on May 15, 2006 21:30:40 GMT -5
I love Elfman's theme more than anyone. I could not tell you how disappointed I was when they left it out of Batman Forever and Batman and Robin. However, since they are essentially starting over with Batman Begins adn the sequels I feel the music must change and I do believe the music from Batman Begins was done very well. Much better then BF and BnR.
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Post by All Star Batman on May 15, 2006 21:38:36 GMT -5
I'd have to say no. While it was the best of all time, this is a restart of the series, and it should be left out.
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Post by J-Man on May 16, 2006 14:14:51 GMT -5
[shadow=purple,left,300]No. After seeing Batman Begins, I can say that the Elfman theme really wouldn't fit the atmosphere of this new restart.[/shadow]
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Post by Faithfulbutler on May 16, 2006 18:32:18 GMT -5
Elfman's Score is very special i do agree,however it has it's place in the Bat-Mythos and i feel it doesn't have a place in this new start.
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Post by JokerFC on May 24, 2006 12:54:20 GMT -5
what an iconic tune a real classic IMO as well as the end score when he is looking at the batsignal-rousing to say the least.BUT also very Burton so no leave it out. I do however love Elfmans music though as it stands he is the definitive Batman music guy ;D
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Post by enchantaurora on Jun 4, 2006 21:15:22 GMT -5
I wouldn't want to see Elfman's score in any of the new movies, but I am disappointed that the music of BB was no where near as memorable. I'm not saying it was bad (it wasn't) actually it was very good. But... it's not going to be like the Elfman score. It's not going to immediately signal "Batman" to anyone that hears it, you know?
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dasknight
Legions of Gotham Police Officer
I miss my parents.
Posts: 107
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Post by dasknight on Jun 4, 2006 21:24:57 GMT -5
I am disappointed that the music of BB was no where near as memorable. I'm not saying it was bad (it wasn't) actually it was very good. But... it's not going to be like the Elfman score. It's not going to immediately signal "Batman" to anyone that hears it, you know? My thoughts exactly. I realise WB & Nolan are trying the distance themselves from the original franchise, but I think that the Batman theme has become part of the Dark Knight mythos, which is why I was surprised at the responses to this question. However, I can see your POV in wishing to keep this reboot different from what came before it.
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Post by RJ on Jun 6, 2006 5:25:19 GMT -5
I think Danny Elfman's music is amazing. I own several of his soundtracks, including Batman '89, BR, and Nightmare, and I could listen to them over and over. I agree that there should be a general "theme" for Batman. When James Bond comes to the screen, or Darth Vader, you know it by the music. Elfman had that in his Batman, and I was upset that the Begins didn't, it leaves a certin bit of excitement out of the film.
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Post by TheQuestion on Jun 6, 2006 16:49:54 GMT -5
I have been a Danny Elfman fan for almost as long as I can remember being alive.
I can sing/hum the whole batman theme as well as other of his works, but I thought the Batman Begins music was perfect. I loved how soft and complementary it was to the movie, it never took you out of the movie. And though I never would have said this before BB came out, I wouldn't trade the new score for anything else.
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Post by TheQuestion on Jun 8, 2006 15:25:59 GMT -5
On second thought, it would be kinda cool for the phantasm-esque theme to pop up during the film's climax. (Like when Batman confronts the Joker in JLA season 1)
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filmationbatmanfan
Legions Of Gothamite
Let's face it BatMite you're a nice guy but you're also a royal pain! 1977
Posts: 69
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Post by filmationbatmanfan on Oct 3, 2006 12:43:48 GMT -5
I am really passionate about Danny Elfman's Batman movie scores and I really hated it when he was not involved with Batman Forever and Batman and Robin. Elliot Goldenthal sucked! I would have loved to have heard what kind of score themes Elfman could have composed for Robin, the Riddler, and Two Face at least. But I feel his music should not be in The Dark Knight. The score to Batman Begins was truly superb and it should continue in that same style of the first movie with only one improvement. Please have a title theme since Batman Begins did not have a main title or theme. For a theme, I play the Batmobile music. Cheers.
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Post by ??Gothic Riddler?? on Oct 6, 2006 4:03:43 GMT -5
His theme to Batman is iconic and my favourite bat-tune
sadly it does not suit the BB universe
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Post by MuksC on Oct 6, 2006 6:54:46 GMT -5
no, leave it out/separate.
Nolan & Co purposely didn't want an "iconic" theme, because that would remind everyone of the original 2 movies, and then we'd all be saying "this new theme isn't as good as the original Elfman theme". by simply not having a main theme, they avoid this comparison, and i think they have done the correct thing.
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Post by Dark Nightwing on Oct 6, 2006 11:56:03 GMT -5
I think TDK should have a main theme to it. Something much darker than any of the previous themes. Perhaps have the bass voices as the melody. This could be contrasted by a Joker theme that would be high pitched, but creepy. The music was great for Begins, but the sequel is the time to raise the bar. Too many sequels turn out exactly the same as the original. I am sure that this will not the be the case for Batman this time around.
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Post by enchantaurora on Oct 6, 2006 20:11:26 GMT -5
I think TDK should have a main theme to it. Something much darker than any of the previous themes. Perhaps have the bass voices as the melody. This could be contrasted by a Joker theme that would be high pitched, but creepy. I would definitely like to here those bass voices. And though Danny Elfman obviously won't be doing this, they need to make it just as memorable (though to be honest , I'm not sure that that's possible.
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Post by craigomoteo on Nov 4, 2006 19:21:36 GMT -5
I can see both sides, but I guess I'll play devil's advocate here. Superman Returns restarted that franchise and hearing John Williams famous theme and seeing the familiar blue opening titles literally gave me goosebumps as I sat in the movie theatre in wide-eyed anticipation of the first Superman film in many years. The obvious difference here is that SR picked up where S2 left off, and BB was a fresh start to the franchise. Now that BB has renewed credibility lost by the end of the previous franchise, paying homage to the original theme of Batman and BR would be no less acceptable than hearing the classic Superman theme in SR (in my opinion). It has seem to become a tradition to pay homage in this genre. Noel Neil and Kirk Alyn (the original Lois Lane & Superman of the 40's movie serials) had a cameo in Superman '78. Neil and Jack Larson (Lois Lane & Jimmy Olsen of 50's television) appeared in Superman Returns. Terrance Stamp, who played General Zod in S1 and S2 plays the voice of Jor-El in Smallville. Before his death, Chris Reeve and Margot Kidder appeared in Smallville. Annette O'Toole, who played Lana Lang in S3, plays Martha Kent on Smallville. And listen to the opening theme music to the current "The Batman" cartoon. The "POW BIF BAM" musical punches are an obvious throwback to the Neil Hefti theme of the 1966 Batman series that fans claimed for years destroyed the character's credibility. Is anybody complaining now? Bringing back the well known Elfman theme wouldn't kill the new franchise. It would only give homage to the original intent of the previous franchise before it was corrupted as others have been. The path to Hell is paved with good intentions. We must always remember the good intentions.
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Post by Dark Nightwing on Nov 4, 2006 22:45:07 GMT -5
I REALLY didn't like the opening to SR. While it was an homage, it looked to old to be moderna and it really slowed things down.
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Post by BruceBatman on May 27, 2007 15:33:14 GMT -5
Yes the theme should be back in my opinion!!!!!!!!! I posted a topic on this same thing! I think the original music was awesome but the music from BB was a little boring!
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Post by Jack-Ups on May 27, 2007 15:50:01 GMT -5
no it shouldent be put anywhere near the sequel I like the music alot fomr BB all of it , where wit hthe elfman films there's one song which is just repeated which is alittle boring.
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Post by Batlaw on May 27, 2007 17:54:22 GMT -5
I dont think they should re-use the Elfman theme. I really liked it and wouldnt care all that much if they did somehow use or incorporate it into their own. Elfman's music was booming and Iconic and focused on "emoting". Moreso for the audience in a traditional sense (sensational... but traditional). The Zimmer / Howard music was brilliantly subtle and almost tangible. Their's was more "tonal" and enhanced the story by becoming part of it and assuming the form of the story's environments. I agree overall its not as commanding or "signature", and even a bit lack laster seemingly at first. but I find it complex and ingenious. Listen to the soundtrack a few times and you start picking up incredible imagery and insight. For example, some of the tracks almost mimic Gotham City... the crowds, traffic and street noise. some manage to embody and project musically a sense of claustrophobia and strife of the citizens or the relentlessness of Bruce Wayne. Some brilliant and compelling stuff IMO and masterfully done.
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RevMarc
Legions of Gotham Police Officer
Posts: 157
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Post by RevMarc on Jul 9, 2007 21:20:17 GMT -5
I read something a while back by the composers that they intentionally didn't "finish" Batman's theme in Begins because he was just getting started and something along the lines of "he hadn't earned it yet". They did say that by the end of the film there were definite hints at what the full theme would be in TDK.
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Post by MuksC on Jul 10, 2007 14:13:06 GMT -5
the music part i liked a lot in BB was where Gordon comes to the docks and sees Falcone attached to the light, and then sees the bat silhouette in the clouds, then we see the iconic shot of Batman on top of the skyscraper as the camera pans round. that was a great iconic moment there with the music, how it builds and builds sort of to a climax.
amd i agree, a whole soundtrack with different tunes works wel, like it did in Begins, instead of just 1 tune repeated in various styles throughout, as in Batman'89 (although that worked well in it's own way, but i'm happy for them to stick with the new style so they're not simply copying the framework of Batman'89).
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Post by BruceBatman on Jul 11, 2007 0:27:07 GMT -5
As long as it "is Batman" I'm okay with it! I would love to hear a lot of Bass!
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Post by Dark Nightwing on Jul 11, 2007 21:05:34 GMT -5
I read something a while back by the composers that they intentionally didn't "finish" Batman's theme in Begins because he was just getting started and something along the lines of "he hadn't earned it yet". They did say that by the end of the film there were definite hints at what the full theme would be in TDK. That is the first time I have seen this information. This completely makes sense in relation to the character and the story. Thank you very much for this information.
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RevMarc
Legions of Gotham Police Officer
Posts: 157
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Post by RevMarc on Jul 14, 2007 21:35:31 GMT -5
My pleasure. ;D
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Post by HUSH on Jul 15, 2007 5:32:40 GMT -5
I love the Elfman music as much as the next fan, but I really feel it belongs to the Burton movies and B:TAS. Not only would it not fit Nolan's version, but it would run counter to this new series being separate and independent of the previous films. I do really like what they did with the score in Begins and agree that it was subtle but meaningful. I think that they should go back to that for TDK, but perhaps renew the score to be more iconic and distinctive, since for this film I think that will be very important. Begins was leading up to this, so it'd be fitting to get the same feel when comparing the scores. When the title credits come on, I want to know that this is the big one. I also agree that special care should be taken to give the Joker a great presence via the score.
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