If DC were to Ultimatize....

[JotaEse]

If DC were to Ultimatize, what do you think they should do.

I think they should basically follow the MArvel Ultimate formula, but in their style (we don't need an issue of Lois and Clark sitting in a room talking all issue...damn MArvel...)

Start with Superman's first year in Metropolis in "Definitive Superman" of whatever they wanna call their Ultimate line. You start, of course, with Luthor in a 6-month to a year launch arc. At right around the same time you introduce the "Definitive BAtman" title...maybe the same month. Batman starts with fighting regular criminals 1-3 months after Batman sightings have began in a 6-issue arc that shows early Bat-mistakes and him learning. A Good detective story. The second arc features him trying to stop a robbery-ring ending with Red Hood falling in the chemicals/whatever, and you leave it there...DO NOT show the Joker. NExt 6-issues would be a HArvey Dent/Two-Face arc, followed by possibly the introduction of Robin or the Catwoman arc. You could save the Robin story for the 3rd year if you wanted...base this decision on sales. You DO NOT need to tell much of their Origins early for these two...you're not gonna change it much, and who doesn't know it?

About 6-12 months later you introduce "Definitive Justice" with a Justice League featuring Wonder Woman, Flash, Green Lantern, Martian Manhunter, Aquaman, GReen Arrow, & Black Canary. It's mentioned that heroes are popping up, and sometimes there will be problems too biig. It can start with a global threat (invasion, etc) that either doesn't mention Bats and Supes or has Superman targetted early and Bats too focused on Gotham. Then you can move on. About 3-4 years in, if you feel the market is ready, you can introduce the Teen Titans. Maybe also have, at some point "Definitive DC" which features 1-6 issue stories featuring other characters/solo adventures of JLA characters. You could have a 3-issue Elongated Man/Sue Dibny mystery followed by a 1-Issue Green Arrow/Black Canary team-up followed by a...let's say...2 issue Red Tornado or Plastic MAn or Blue BEetle or Captain MArvel story.

Everyone, give me your opinion.

[reideen1313]

That's kind of what happened post-Crisis and again, to a lesser extent, post-Zero Hour. I'm not really interested in seeing them go thru another continuity cleaning event where they reintroduce the character.

[/\/\att]

[shadow=green,left,300]I would like to see them go back and fix a lot of the things that are screwed up...

...what I mean is over time creative teams change, the comic buying audience changes and what they did 20 yrs ago just doesn't fly now...but the Crisis was really a lame cop-out. I'd like to either see them go back and fix some of the problems with old continuity...ie: bring back Barry Allen

OR they could go "ultimate" in their own way...I wouldn't mind a new continuity...after time things can get so convoluted...hell animation can do it, why not comics?[/shadow]

[Roback]

Following Marvels lead would be a smart move. I would love to see DC take this step.

[reideen1313]

/\/\att said:

[shadow=green,left,300]I'd like to either see them go back and fix some of the problems with old continuity...ie: bring back Barry Allen
[/shadow]

no no no no no no no no no (I could keep going...) ;D

No Barry! Barry is dead. Wally has come into his own and really developed as a character because of Barry's death. I don't want to see him go thru the (unavoidable if he comes back) self doubt that he would feel since he would be in Barry's shadow again.

Barry can appear in specials, like JLA Year One, or in flashbacks like IDC - but not in the regular universe.

Barry and Bucky are the two characters that should always stay dead. Everyone else is fair game.

[JotaEse]

no...not everyone. Hal Jordan should have stayed dead too.

[HUSH]

reideen1313 said:

I'm not really interested in seeing them go thru another continuity cleaning event where they reintroduce the character.

Absolutely not. IMO, the DCU is as close to perfect as it can be right now, especially Batman, despite the dreaded Bat-family. SoI hope DC doesn't do the ultimate thing.

[Batdan]

OK, get ready for a very long post. I apolgize if this violates board etiquette but I think this thread is a great idea and I'd like to give my five cents. I welcome all opinions once you read through because I'm proposing some radical ideas.

Personally, I think a separate Ultimate-style continuity would be refreshing. I'd even take it a step further, especially where Batman's concerned: I'd make it cross-over free and I would ground it in a modern-day reality that allows for neither aliens nor mutants nor other superheroes. Batman is at his best when he inhabits an urban world. It's makes little sense to me that Batman currently exists in a universe where there's a Martian Manhunter. Or even a Green Lantern.

Here's my off-the-wall proposal, taking bits and pieces from my favorite Batman creators (Miller, Englehart, O'Neil, TAS) and adding some of my own ideas:

-- Batman is the only hero in this universe. Period. Not even Superman. I've long felt that comics universes are overpopulated with super-powered beings to the point of outlandishness. Batman is the only character, when he's written appropriately (read: Year One), where you can actually allow yourself to think: "Y'know, that could happen." I would love to see writers and artists explore this idea.

-- Gotham is not overpopulated with supervillains. The backstory is that Gotham is a great city, but corrupt in the halls of power. Pulling the strings is political kingpin Rupert Thorne. Gotham is also the only fictional city in this universe. No references to Metropolis or Star City, for that matter.

-- The supervillains who are around are not superpowered.
-- Batman's greatest nemesis remains the Joker.
-- The Penguin would be a shady ally of Thorne's in the Gotham underworld.
-- There is no Two-Face -- at least at the beginning.
-- Deadshot would roam here, as would Hugo Strange. Scarecrow would probably show up in some form. And there might be some way to work the Riddler in.
-- But no Killer Croc. If there must be a Bane, he must be scaled back.
-- Ra's al Ghul? I suppose, but Batman doesn't go galivanting across the globe. He's an urban avenger. Ra's would have to somehow fit into that concept. International financier bankrolling a terrorist organization? Mayhap.

-- Catwoman would be his foil. She would show up from time to time and drive him just a little crazy.

-- There is no Robin. Or Batgirl, Oracle, Huntress, Nightwing, whatever. This Batman works alone. Now if the writers did feel a burning desire to introduce Robin at some point, he or she would be just old enough to do it, i.e. late teens. Batman doesn't need the hassle of looking after a kid and doesn't need any child endangerment charges.

-- It's Lt. Jim Gordon. Batman is an outlaw but he's able to get by with the help of an honest cop on the inside and Assistant DA Harvey Dent. Gordon is divorced. He doesn't have a daughter and he doesn't have a niece named Barbara.

-- Alfred is his greatest, most trusted ally. Nuff said.

--Bruce Wayne is impossibly wealthy. But Batman understands that his role is to work under the radar. Therefore, little or no flashy arsenal: Just what he needs to get the work done.
-- Batmobile? Probably, though driving through a densely populated city like Gotham would probably be counterproductive.
-- Batcave? Maybe.
-- Batplane? No.
-- Utility belt? Yes, with pouches.

-- Maybe, just maybe, one or two laws of physics can be broken. First and foremost, Batman has to operate in a world we could live in. But there will be times when the writers would need room to breathe, so I'd say a certain stretching of scientific limits would be acceptable. To the point where a scientist could turn into Mr. Freeze? Perhaps. To the point where a human being could run faster than the speed of sound? No.

Thoughts?

[gotham95]

[shadow=blue,left,300]With the big push behind the movie next summer I woul be surprised NOT to see some book like this staring to adhere to the new or reborn fans from the theatres. Maybe it'll be like an Ultimate book or just a plain canon style book. But I'm sure there will be something new. [/shadow]

[HUSH]

I wouldn't mind if they were to make an ultimate style Batman book, but it couldn't touch or influence the regular Batman universe. As long as it was separate from the comic going on now, and didn't change that, it would be okay.

[Mr. Freeze]

i remembered a while back Wizard magazine did a article where they showed ultimate dc, im trying to find pics now, if i do find them i'll post them here.

[Mr. Freeze]

ok i found the pics, it took me a while to find them but here they are
batman

superman

flash

green lantern

wonder woman

and the teen titans

[/\/\att]

[shadow=green,left,300]Great, thx for posting these Freeze! Was it just some kind of 'what if' article?[/shadow]

[Mr. Freeze]

from what Ive heard yeah, to bad too, I would have love to see batman looking like that in a comic book. If you guys want i could post some of the origins that some of them had.

[/\/\att]

I don't know about everyone else, but I'd LOVE to hear some of 'em Freeze!

[Mr. Freeze]

here is the story and origin for the Teen Titans

THE ORIGIN: it's 'N Sync meets superheroes. When the JLA emerges as media darlings after their battle with Despero, LexCorp manufactures its own superteam. Gathering a group of hip, good-looking teenagers with superhuman abilities, Luthor's PR team designs marketable codenames and costumes for each. Calling them the "Teen Titans" (a name the team hates), Luthor now has a cash-cow bonanza first, "superhero" team second.

THE CHARACTERS: Placing ads in all the Hollywood trades, LexCorp holds auditions for the team. First to sign on is a young acrobat named Rich Grayson, who desperately wants to escape his life in the carnival act with his parents. Coming prepared with the code-name "Nightwing" he's more than a little disappointed to instead be labeled "Robin." Then there's Raven, a mysterious goth-chick who spent years living on the streets through a combination of street smarts and her control of her "living darkness." Escaping from the island of Themyscira was easy for Donna (who creates a last name In Troy), but escaping her big sister Diana's shadow may be harder; Donna is given the codename Power Girl (instead of the proposed name 'Wonder Girl'' to avoid trademark infringement with theJLA's Wonder Woman), which suits her fine since she wishes her presence in Man's World remain secret from her Amazon sisters. The arrogant Prince Arthur of Atlantis, a 19-year-old future king called Aquaman, wants to familiarize himself with the surface world before taking up his royal responsibilities; he insists he's the team's natural leader, much to the chagrin of the others. Roy Harper - given the name Green Arrow - was raised on an Indian reservation learning deadshot marksmanship with his bow; the wildcard of the team, Roy takes immense pleasure in ribbing team-mates (like calling Robin "Dick." or Aquarnan 'Artie"). The final piece to the Teen Titans make-up is accident victim Victor Stone, who LexCorp rebuilt as Cyborg.

THE FIRST ARC: Marketed as a pop-star superteam, the Teen Titans are sent out to battle low-level supervillains and thugs, allowing decisive victories. But when the team discovers Green Arrow overdosing on Ecstasy after a rave with Raven, the Titans secretly buck their bosses in their off-hours to get their hands dirty, They take out an E lab without telling LexCorp, which wants to keep the team's image squeaky clean. During the raid though, Power Girl accidentally kills a dealer, creating rifts among members. What's worse - keeping all of their esctracurricular activities on the downlow proves tougher than they ever imagined, particularly when members like Green Arrow, Raven and Cyborg refuse to participate!

THE BIG PICTURE: With a murder hanging over the team's collective heads, the Titans still participate in more nightly raids on drug dealers and gang-bangers, But as time goes on, their meta-human vigilante activities spark the first Ultimate DC crossover by attracting the attention of a rival team: the Justice League.

[Mr. Freeze]

here is the origin and story of the Flash

ORIGIN: Crime scene investigator Barry Allen works in one of the fastest cities in the world - Los Angeles. Called to a crime scene inside Cadmus Labs Research Facility (a subsidiary of LexCorp), Allen's collection of evidence accidentally exposes him to a host of experimental substances, Invisible to the naked eye, tasteless, odorless... these compounds trigger something within Allen's biochemistry, transforming him into the fastest man alive!

THE CHARACTER: As one of the top crime scene investigators in the country, Barry Allen is often called upon to tackle L.A.'s most bizarre cases. A one-man crime lab thanks to his keen mind and inhuman speed, the fastest man alive now has what it takes to stay one step ahead of the criminals.

SUPPORTING CAST: L.A. Detective Jay Garrick is Allen's best friend and the only person who knows he's secretly the Flash. Even Assistant District Attorney Iris West, Allen's off-again, on-again flame, doesn't know his secret. Of course, she's got her own problems now that she's taken in her young nephew Wally West after years of parental abuse. Making things harder for Allen is that the rebellious Wally doesn't trust any cop, even if they're dating his Aunt Iris.

THE SET-UP: After realizing he's gained the power to run faster than the speed of sound, Allen develops a slick running outfit to disguise his identity while investigating crimes as the Flash. While experimenting with his powers, Barry discovers a downside to his abilities: the more he uses his speed, the faster his body shows signs of aging. But just as Barry begins to master his power and gets a lead on the serial killer Murmur, someone else with superhuman speed calling himself Black Flash arrives on the scene. What's worse, he knows all of Barry's secrets and wants the Scarlet Speedster dead.

THE BIG PICTURE: "I'lI never forgive you!" screams Black Flash as he pummels Allen in their first meeting. This grief-stricken foe stands revealed as none other than a future Wally VVest! Haunted for years by Wally's hatred, Allen eventually learns he'll make a wrong decision that costs the lives of two JLA teammates... and Iris West.

[Mr. Freeze]

here is the story and origin for Superman

The Origin: Rocketed from the dying planet krypton, a lone baby lands in a Smallville kansas field. Adopted by Martha and Jonathan Kent, the infant is raised like any other child, but the kents soon learn their adopted son Clark is anything but ordinary. Under the Earth's yellow sun, he's developed powers and abilities far beyond those of mortal men.

The Character: It's six years removed from the world of TV's "Smallville", where Clark, Lex Luthor and Lana Lang all grew up together as friends. Clark's just graduated from kansas state university and has been offered an entry level job at the Daily Planet.

Supporting Cast: Lana's still Clark's girlfriend and one of the few people who knows about his extraodinary powers. But his long distance relationship with Lana (who is still in Smallville) is strained as Clark grows closer to fellow Planet reporter Lois Lane. Lois, a tenacious and clever reporter, is also the protege of Planet senior writer Perry White, the an who mentors Lois and Clark in both thier work and perosnal lives. And just as Clark settles in Metropolis, billionaire industrialist Lex Luthor reemerges after a four year disappearence from the public life. Although Clark looks forward to seeing his old friend from Smallville, something has clearly made Lex more intense, but Lex isn't talking.

The Set Up: After learning to control and master his powers while growing up in Smallville, Clark Kent moves to Metropolis and dons a costume to help protect the world as Superman, a name Perry White gives to him after seeing him save a sabotaged Air Force One.

The First Arc: Superman wasn't the only thing to escape krypton. An artifical intelligence program developed by Jor-El, Superman's father, also reached Earth. Calling itself Brainiac 1, the super computer sets its sights on turning Earth into New Krypton...just as soon as it undoes the "Damage" done to Krypton's last son by those who raised him human.

The Big Picture: As Clark tries to reestablish his friendship with Lex, he doesn't realize that lex knows he's Superman!

The Catch: Lex refuses to admit it to himself. Lex feels that if Clark-who represents lex's only tether to a humanity that has constantly betrayed him-has been lying to him their entire lives. it's a Superman who has to pay the price.

[Mr. Freeze]

Here is the origin and story for the Green Lantern

The Origin: Dishonorably discharged by the military's highly trained Delta Force, John Stewart's life is going nowhere...until he's recruited into the intergalactic police force called the Green Lantern Corps. A rookie grunt assigned to Sector 2814 Earth, Stewart's mentor is the corps most senior officer Sinestro.

The Character: No one knows why Stewart was thrown out of Delta Force but as he puts it "I had one bad day" A social activist now in Los Angeles, Stewart's happy to serve out his days not fighting in anyone's wars, until he's given the power to truly make a diffrence.

Supporting Cast: A slew of Alien GLs fill the title, but Stewart's main interaction is with his training officer Sinestro. A brilliant strategist and one of the most powerful Green Lanterns ever, Sinestro will give John Stewart (and the reader) the vibe that this Green Lantern may be furthering a dark agenda.

The Set Up: Trained by Sinestro, Stewart quickly gains a reputation as a hotshot upstart. And, like his fellow officers on the GLC planet Oa, he still never sees their commanders called the Guardians, who are said to give the rings their power.

The First Arc: Think "Training Day" in outer space. The rookie GL asks " What happened to the other Green Lanterns before me?" "Simple" says Sinestro with a smile. "It didn't work out." As Sinestro reveals his shadier side while the story progresses, Stewart grows more and more interested in just where the guardians and his new ring and power battery come from.

The Big Picture: Over time, Stewart discovers the guardians are dead-killed by Sinestro, who's been secretly running the Corps for some time now. He also learns that his mentor has been giving rings to inadequate Green Lanterns to dupe the various solar systems into a false sense of security, mudering any Corps member who gave Sinestro any potential opposition, His ultimate goal: The creation of robotic Manhunters deep inside Oa to destroy the flawed GL Corps, subjugate the planets under thier protection and set Sinestro up as the conqueror of the Galaxy.

[Batdan]

What about their Batman origin? I'd like to see how it compares against my own Batifesto, which I posted earlier on this thread.

[Mr. Freeze]

For Batman, I havent had a chance to find it yet im still looking, if I do find it i'll post it here.

[vishman007]

JotaEse said:

I think they should basically follow the MArvel Ultimate formula, but in their style (we don't need an issue of Lois and Clark sitting in a room talking all issue...damn MArvel...)

Some of the best issues of ultimate spider-man are the ones where peter and mary jane just talk.

I think an Ultimate DC line would be cool, but i'm not sure how they could make it much different. Part of making the ultimate marvel line was that they wanted to make spider-man and the x-men teenagers again, but in a contemporary setting. The DC heroes were always adults.