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Post by Valor777 on Apr 2, 2005 5:23:01 GMT -5
So many weird things are going on in the Bat comic Universe lately. Jason Todd is (supposedly) back. Nightwing's origin (in NW: year one) and him meeting Jason are a little different to how we remember them in Teen Titans and Batman : The New Adventures (post-crisis). Heck, even Jason becoming Robin was told differently. As for Jason coming back...well....last time DC tried to bring a dead character back (Supergirl), they got it wrong the first time and it was the real deal the second time around. If this *is* Jason, I'd be happy (I've always been interested by the character) and I'm also interested to know whether he'll turn to the 'dark side'.  |
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Post by jlavaia on Apr 2, 2005 14:47:49 GMT -5
if he were an alternate Jason, then they would have to explain what the alternate joker did to him that would make him attack our joker. i think he's the real deal. also, when eveyone is mentioning Ra's, i hope that they are referring to Nyssa his daughter who is now The Demon's Head. because if you're referring to the original Ra's then they will have to also explain how ashes become man. Batman burned his body at the end of "death and the maidens". maybe Nyssa, Jason, and Hush are all in league. remember Nyssa had stolen the kryptonite from the cave. that or it could be Checkmate. they would know where the last pit is, so maybe they brought him to it. regardless it would have to be someone who knows who Batman is.
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Post by ProfessorHStrange on Apr 2, 2005 18:30:55 GMT -5
One thing Wineck was mum in an interview with NEWSARMA was Jason Todd was older or looked older than he was suppossed to be. So was he put in the Lazarus Pit revived and aged or was a Jason from an alternate dimension who had a survived the attack by the Joker? Time will tell I guess! ProfessorH !  |
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Post by JotaEse on Apr 3, 2005 4:37:00 GMT -5
My philosophy (Spoilers, of course....or possible ones...including Countdown....)
Max Lord dipped Young Mr. Todd in the L. Pit after the funeral...or before (closed casket) and has been working with him/using him since then, internally in Checkmate. Why do I think that?
Judd: The why is not going to be important for a really long time. The only hint I’ll give is that it’s no accident that DC Countdown and the return of Jason Todd happened on the same day.
That leads to my theory....
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Post by JokerFC on Apr 3, 2005 9:12:21 GMT -5
Max Lord dipped Young Mr. Todd in the L. Pit after the funeral...or before (closed casket) and has been working with him/using him since then, internally in Checkmate. Why do I think that?  I also think it was lord in the light of recent revalations,I always thought it was Ras or someone powereful and lord fits that bill |
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Post by jlavaia on Apr 3, 2005 15:16:26 GMT -5
Checkmate has been going after Batman for a long time. remember they hired Cameron Chase to find out his identity, they hired Sasha, they tried to make Huntress their queen so they could get info on him. now Max Lord runs chackmate, he already knew alot about Batman, and now he knows everything about him and everyone. so he would definetely know where the last pit is. also Jason doesnt seem to have aged too much, i mean he looks alittle older but not much. and i think the body was taken right before or during the "hush" arc. because unless Hush is somehow involved with checkmate, how would he know that the body was missing. Basil Karlo does not know who Batman is, so he didnt just think up being Jason, Hush had him do that, and this was after Batman found the grave empty. so maybe Hush is also involved, he knows alittle too much about everyone to not be involved in some way. i cant wait to see it unfold.
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Dr. Crane
Legions of Gotham Police Officer
To conquer fear you must BECOME fear
Posts: 146
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Post by Dr. Crane on Apr 3, 2005 16:35:53 GMT -5
Checkmate has been going after Batman for a long time. remember they hired Cameron Chase to find out his identity, they hired Sasha, they tried to make Huntress their queen so they could get info on him. now Max Lord runs chackmate, he already knew alot about Batman, and now he knows everything about him and everyone. so he would definetely know where the last pit is. also Jason doesnt seem to have aged too much, i mean he looks alittle older but not much. and i think the body was taken right before or during the "hush" arc. because unless Hush is somehow involved with checkmate, how would he know that the body was missing. Basil Karlo does not know who Batman is, so he didnt just think up being Jason, Hush had him do that, and this was after Batman found the grave empty. so maybe Hush is also involved, he knows alittle too much about everyone to not be involved in some way. i cant wait to see it unfold. Right now they also have him as a big player in gotham nights. would DC put him as a big star in 2 series? |
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Post by Robin on Apr 3, 2005 19:16:17 GMT -5
My fav line in this issue was when Black Mask said, "Li, will you please shut the hell up? I swear to God, it's like trying to run a criminal organization with my mother." Lol that was great.
Anyways, I don't like the sounds of chracters from other "worlds" and stuff. I think this Jason was revived from a lazarus pit. Making him more evil.
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Post by JokerFC on Apr 3, 2005 19:40:38 GMT -5
Anyways, I don't like the sounds of chracters from other "worlds" and stuff. I think this Jason was revived from a lazarus pit. Making him more evil. yeah me neither Robin no alternate universe jasons,no having him conflicted just plain bad.......then kill him off again ;D |
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Post by JotaEse on Apr 3, 2005 22:08:07 GMT -5
Of course, as Judd said.....we won't find out for quite a while...probably until October or later during Crisis.
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Post by Robin on Apr 4, 2005 16:43:04 GMT -5
.......then kill him off again ;D  |
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Post by jlavaia on Apr 4, 2005 17:26:34 GMT -5
I think this Jason was revived from a lazarus pit. i also think that thats the case. there's one pit left, and the only living people who know where it is are: Batman, Nyssa, Talia, Riddler, Hush, and i imagine Max Lord. maybe its tied into Villains United. remember what Luthor said in Superman/Batman # 6 about there being a crisis. Talia could have told him where the pit was or taken him there, and maybe he revived Jason. Calculator could also have knowledge of where the pit is, his information net is as large as Oracle's and maybe even larger. |
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Post by JokerFC on Apr 4, 2005 18:20:15 GMT -5
hmmmm  villians united never occured to me......
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Post by Robin on Apr 4, 2005 19:51:15 GMT -5
i also think that thats the case. there's one pit left, and the only living people who know where it is are: Batman, Nyssa, Talia, Riddler, Hush, and i imagine Max Lord. maybe its tied into Villains United. remember what Luthor said in Superman/Batman # 6 about there being a crisis. Talia could have told him where the pit was or taken him there, and maybe he revived Jason. Calculator could also have knowledge of where the pit is, his information net is as large as Oracle's and maybe even larger. |
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Post by gotham95 on Apr 10, 2005 15:10:27 GMT -5
[shadow=blue,left,300]I must say, that with the exception of War Games, DC has really made me anxiously anticipate each issue of Batman. It's like I'm reading them as a kid again. Great time to be a Batman fan.
I too will reserve speculation sevearl months to see where this goes. Jason's return is interesting. I hope it stays that way.[/shadow]
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Nuptse
Legions Of Gothamite
Veni, Vidi, Velcro.
Posts: 64
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Post by Nuptse on Apr 13, 2005 23:39:07 GMT -5
Yeah, I saw the cover and rolled my eyes but bought it anyway. How many times can they jerk our (and Batman's) chain before actually bringing JTodd back? It feels like they play the "Good (dead-myfault-angstpaingrief) Soldier" in different shades (*koff* StefBrown *koff*) so much that I agree - his ghost is much larger than the living Jason Todd ever was.
At first I was betting on all the soap opera cliches: long lost evil twin brother separated at birth, villain with plastic surgery, even bot!JasonTodd - some way to rip that healed scab off Batman's wound once more but leave him still as dead as he was before. But after reading the posts before, I'm in on the Laz Pit idea as a workable idea. Hey, I'm an angst-whore at heart, so I'm all about Batpain. I just hope they use it as more than a 'bet you didn't see that coming!' twist that's misused and dressed up in high heels and lipstick. Make him irreversably ebbil - force Bats to 'kill' him or go beyond his limits both emotionally and ethically. Just please, please, don't make him like one of those punchy clowns that just keep popping back up no matter how hard you hit it so Jason doesn't become one of those handy Ratings Winner! guest stars.
I like his concept, I liked his placement, but I like his ghost even more.
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Post by JokerFC on Apr 14, 2005 7:30:21 GMT -5
I liked his placement, but I like his ghost even more. well said!! |
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Post by HUSH on Apr 23, 2005 21:40:15 GMT -5
I finally read the final issue of the "Under the Hood" storyline. I must say, I like the whole ordeal. Jason's return changes so many things and will cause so much pain for Bats. And the part where he got revenge on Joker by beating him with a crowbar was so excellent! |
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Post by HUSH on Apr 23, 2005 21:43:46 GMT -5
Make him irreversably ebbil - force Bats to 'kill' him or go beyond his limits both emotionally and ethically. That would be too cool. And about the fake ressurections, I hear you; This had better be the real thing. Once is enough. |
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Violator
Legions of Gotham Police Officer
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Post by Violator on Apr 24, 2005 11:36:30 GMT -5
I agree that Jason made a better Martyr (sp?) than he did a sidekick. If this is Jason brought back from the dead, Id like to see it played out as some grand scheme. That not only was his rebirth planned but also his death. Anyone else find it odd that in "A Death In The Family" Bruce had followed the Joker to the Middle East and that also happened to be where Jason's potenial mothers were? The Bat Computer showed 3 possible matches to Jasons birth certificate: Sharmin Rosen, Shiva Woosan, and Sheila Haywood. Sheila knew the Joker back in Gotham, so that was the perfect oppurtunity for the Joker and Jason to cross paths. Now what if this was all planned by some master manipulator to put Bruce through the grief and pain for Jasons death and to amplify it when Jason was brought back? To me, the only person worthy of such a plan is Ra's al Ghul, (the real Ra's not Nyssa) but seeing as he's still dead Im not really sure how it could work.
Anyways, thats my take on it. If theyre going to take away the significance of his death, they should atleast make it into something that 'seemed' planned for years.
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Post by jlavaia on Apr 24, 2005 16:38:17 GMT -5
i was thinking that the actual Jason Todd back from the dead, would be nice but i'm starting to think that maybe its a clone. i think its too much of a coincidence that Judd Winick happens to return Jason right before his Outsiders series features Cadmus. and remember how Cadmus tried to clone Superman on many occasions using his corpse. i hope its the real deal, but i wont be surprised if its not.
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Post by /\/\att on May 5, 2005 3:15:56 GMT -5
well, I don't know if anyone has ever read Green Arrow: Quiver...but it features the story of how Green Arrow comes back to life....his body is wandering earth, but must go to heaven to be re-united with his soul...perhaps its Jason Todd's soulless body running around Gotham...
...just a thought.
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Post by JokerFC on May 5, 2005 6:17:39 GMT -5
all this does is hurt the Joker mythos so Ive decided not to be a fan of this whole scenario 
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Post by anthonywayne on May 31, 2005 15:53:34 GMT -5
Forgive me for being a little cruel- I'll try not to make thing gratuitous or unnecessary...
:)RANT WARNING!
There's a reason a lot of people don't respect comic books. This kind of thing pretty much somes it up. I think the whole thing is a little insulting, myself.
Jason Todd didn't survive because, simply put, people didn't like him. He was a punk, far too angsty for a lot of peoples' taste (mine included- he got on my nerves a bit). But with death came the status of a martyr, thus making his character far more interesting dead than alive. He is Batman's lost soldier. A reminder of the fragility of his partnerships, and I think it's silliness to pervert that solely because another wanna-Robin-be got herself whacked in the line of duty.
I'm sorry, but no matter how hard any writer tries, the return from the dead thing has been done so many times that it's lost its impact, and absolutely nothing done with this story will be able to match the emotional impact of the original loss, which now, assuming the whole thing is true, will be forever tainted.
(shakes head in disbelief)
Mind boggling. Way to go, DC. I have to agree - it cheapens not only the characters but the memories some of us have of that time ("Holy s***, Robin's dead???!!) As much as we may have disliked Jason, his death still meant something; now, it doesn't. I sure hope this is one of those crazy "crisis" or "zero hour" scenarios. |
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Post by Batrez on May 31, 2005 17:19:06 GMT -5
i say give it a try...im liking it. I mean there is alot of questions about jason todd coming back like...who brought him back? How did he aged so quickly? It seems to be a better martial artist and has speed ( throwing a knife to Onxy)..was he if really in the hush stories?
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Post by jlavaia on Jun 1, 2005 13:04:45 GMT -5
here's a quick question, in Batman # 635 Batman and Red Hood fight and Batman's mask comes off, then Red Hood takes his off and then it goes to 3 weeks earlier. are we ever going to see the conclusion to that battle, or has Judd Winick just forgotten it, or are we not up to the present yet?
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Post by Batrez on Jun 1, 2005 14:41:07 GMT -5
conclusion of the fight scene will be next issue
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Post by jlavaia on Jun 2, 2005 8:12:28 GMT -5
beautiful. thanks.
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Post by anthonywayne on Jun 2, 2005 14:32:42 GMT -5
Any guesses as to exctly how this fight concludes? Jason's obviously a murderer now, so Bruce has to try and bring him in...
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